im more on the side of batlord and unknown solider here but this is a good discussion


i think the sentences should be lighter across the board with drugs. if they are first time, non violent offenders, 5 year maximum.

imo there are ppl who will take the risks regardless it they know the penalties are a 5 yr sentence or a life sentence. there are some ppl who are just never goin to be deterred and thats obvious because look at the thousands of crimes that happen yearly where the criminal knows that being caught results in life in prison

i dont know much about this specific case or these chicks. but if they are first time offenders and non violent in their crime, it sounds like an excessiv epunishment. i dunno i see my country's crime rate and rate of imprisonment at astronomical numbers and i dont think thats doing anyone any good

Using a hitman as an example is not a very good one. A hitman is normally an ex-military or espionage agent that has decided to use their skills as an assassin. They're professionals that are normally well remunerated and fully aware of the environment that they're working in. The average drug mule is normally somebody that is easy and vulnerable prey for the drug cartels and is on the promise of easy money, which they may or may not even get.

The community service concept would work, it the Peruvian authorities were remotely interested in the rehabilitation of the offender and what the offender could offer the local community. But they're not and seem to view making examples with punitive punishments their top priority here. But then again should anything else be expected from them, they have no real concept of democracy and fairness in justice is simply an alien concept to them.

Yeah but I want to know what HIS solution or suggestion is...

On a slightly non-related subject, 216 your avatar is giving me a headache.
:banghead:

Sorry if I was trying to wear the bat cape again, I go back to being the riddler again.

Also your last 'quote' wasn't done properly and it looks like I've written it.

I disagree. The fact that the existing penalty doesn't eliminate smuggling simply means there is some subset of the population that is willing to take on the risk for the money involved. If that risk were reduced, not only would more people be willing to take it on, but the cartels could pay them less to do so, thus smuggling more contraband for the same amount of money.

I don't know the situation that well, but wouldn't the airport officials on both sides (source country and destination country) need to be corrupt for that idea to be true? How would corrupt Peruvian officials help get smugglers through US customs, for example?

You might be right. I was just doubting the idea that lightening their sentences wouldn't be good for business from the cartel's POV.

I'm not arguing that at all. They certainly did the crime and should be dealt with accordingly. I'm saying that they're idiots, not violent criminals. People who need to be removed from society should get long-term sentences (well, I have opinions on that, but for the purposes of the current justice system we'll say that) not naive morons who are probably just entertaining romantic Scar Face fantasies. They may know about the consequences of drug smuggling, both on themselves and on the people who will buy the drugs, but I doubt they have any real, visceral appreciation for them on the perceptual level, just like a teen drunk driver likely knows they might kill themselves, but the possibility isn't really "real" to them.

P.S. I don't really care about these people, I just have an issue with your line of reasoning in general and feel it to be irrational and harmful.

Hitmen are violent criminals. See above.

Well, for starters, a five years sentence is about as fair as we're going to get I imagine. In a perfect world though this whole concept of justice as punishment should be done away with. I don't believe in free will, at least not in some magical, religious form. I think our actions are as predetermined by mathematics as a bouncing ball or any other inanimate object. If that's true then the concept of responsibility is based on faulty logic, and punishing people for something because they are "responsible" is as irrational as punishing an asteroid for killing the dinosaurs. The justice system, rather than worrying about punishment, should treat a crime as evidence of some kind of social dysfunction that needs to be "fixed".

If this particular argument goes much farther then it might make sense to split it into its own thread.

This is all well and good, but the fundamental question remains: where is my list of poseur metal bands? ;)

Quit sweatin' me, woman. Alterations must be made. You shall have your list, just keep your knickers on.

You don't have to go through U.S. Customs. If we're using the example of planes, if you own or are renting one, you can simply land at any one of the bazillion private strips in this country. Yeah, there's a chance they could _make_ you land to check your cargo.... but it's about as remote as you can get.