A Logical Argument for Reincarnation

~~Lord Larehip~~ · 07-25-2013, 04:47 PM

I've read your post, Dali, and I appreciate your thoughts on the matter and I'll get back to them sooner or later but I don't want to get bogged down in that right now or I'll never finish this. Let me finish posting my argument.

Okay, having presented a case for the survival of consciousness after death, how do we then make the leap to reincarnation? In a word--sensation.

We have sensations of two particular types: 1. Physical--which are sensations related to the sense-organs such as feeling hot, seeing an apple, smelling bacon frying, touching a rough surface, hearing the chirping of birds, etc. In other words, the sensations caused by and indicative of outside events. 2. Mental--which are sensations related to emotion and qualia. Qualia are sensations we have that are so personal that we cannot describe to others. If I twist my ankle, I can only describe the pain to you, you can't experience it directly. I cannot explain my perception of the color blue. The way I experience the taste of chocolate is known only to me. I cannot convey it to you. The sensation of falling is another quale.

What sets sensation apart from memory is that memory is not real-time but sensation is. I can remember an event long after it happened but the sensations I felt occurred only during that event and are now over. While we can remember an event strongly over the passage of years, sensations will always dwindle to zero eventually. That's why a serial killer must keep killing, for example. For a while, he satisfies himself by recalling his last kill and how good it felt, how sexually gratifying it was, but sooner or later that memory just won't cut it anymore and he will need a new one to replace it with.

Memory and sensation are alike in that both occur in a two-fold process. First I sense an event, then I recall it. That constitutes an experience. With sensation, first I have a certain sensation but MUST experience it again to complete the full sensation. If you get hit the chest with a foul ball, many sensations will go through you but they are so fleeting that you can't categorize them. If you are hit again some months or years later with a another foul ball foul ball or some other object hits you, you will remember the last time you felt that sensation. In fact, you'll remember every single time it's happened. If you hit a patch of black ice in the road and go into a spin, you will remember all the previous times these particular sensations were experienced--when you lost control in the snow driving down the freeway, when your bald tires on a rain-slicked caused you to lose total traction, etc. In other words, you must re-live sensations. You recall memories, you re-live sensations.

In life, you are building up a never-ending catalog of memories and sensations and you'll go on having them right up to the moment of death. Dying in itself produces sensations. But if death extinguishes consciousness, then you can't re-live those experiences. But you can't experience them disembodied either. So what must happen? You must be born again in a new body ready to reap what was sown in the last life. What is called karma.

Why isn't there a heaven or hell? Well, suppose heaven is a place of eternal bliss. How could you feel that? Your consciousness doesn't work that way. All sensations must dwindle to zero over time so this blissful feeling will simply fade. If heaven was a place of transcendent and eternal joy then any earthly memory you have is painful in comparison. CONTRADICTION. You can't have painful memories in a realm where there is only joy for all eternity.

Same with hell. If hell is a place of eternal pain and torment, you can't experience it that way because all sensations dwindle to zero over time. If you can never feel happiness again in this place of agony then any earthly memory will be pleasant in comparison. CONTRADICTION. You can't have pleasant memories in a realm where there is only sorrow for all eternity.

While I have skipped over a lot of stuff to make this as concise as I dare, that is my argument in a nutshell.

07-25-2013, 04:47 PM	#16 (permalink)
~~Lord Larehip~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 899	I've read your post, Dali, and I appreciate your thoughts on the matter and I'll get back to them sooner or later but I don't want to get bogged down in that right now or I'll never finish this. Let me finish posting my argument. Okay, having presented a case for the survival of consciousness after death, how do we then make the leap to reincarnation? In a word--sensation. We have sensations of two particular types: 1. Physical--which are sensations related to the sense-organs such as feeling hot, seeing an apple, smelling bacon frying, touching a rough surface, hearing the chirping of birds, etc. In other words, the sensations caused by and indicative of outside events. 2. Mental--which are sensations related to emotion and qualia. Qualia are sensations we have that are so personal that we cannot describe to others. If I twist my ankle, I can only describe the pain to you, you can't experience it directly. I cannot explain my perception of the color blue. The way I experience the taste of chocolate is known only to me. I cannot convey it to you. The sensation of falling is another quale. What sets sensation apart from memory is that memory is not real-time but sensation is. I can remember an event long after it happened but the sensations I felt occurred only during that event and are now over. While we can remember an event strongly over the passage of years, sensations will always dwindle to zero eventually. That's why a serial killer must keep killing, for example. For a while, he satisfies himself by recalling his last kill and how good it felt, how sexually gratifying it was, but sooner or later that memory just won't cut it anymore and he will need a new one to replace it with. Memory and sensation are alike in that both occur in a two-fold process. First I sense an event, then I recall it. That constitutes an experience. With sensation, first I have a certain sensation but MUST experience it again to complete the full sensation. If you get hit the chest with a foul ball, many sensations will go through you but they are so fleeting that you can't categorize them. If you are hit again some months or years later with a another foul ball foul ball or some other object hits you, you will remember the last time you felt that sensation. In fact, you'll remember every single time it's happened. If you hit a patch of black ice in the road and go into a spin, you will remember all the previous times these particular sensations were experienced--when you lost control in the snow driving down the freeway, when your bald tires on a rain-slicked caused you to lose total traction, etc. In other words, you must re-live sensations. You recall memories, you re-live sensations. In life, you are building up a never-ending catalog of memories and sensations and you'll go on having them right up to the moment of death. Dying in itself produces sensations. But if death extinguishes consciousness, then you can't re-live those experiences. But you can't experience them disembodied either. So what must happen? You must be born again in a new body ready to reap what was sown in the last life. What is called karma. Why isn't there a heaven or hell? Well, suppose heaven is a place of eternal bliss. How could you feel that? Your consciousness doesn't work that way. All sensations must dwindle to zero over time so this blissful feeling will simply fade. If heaven was a place of transcendent and eternal joy then any earthly memory you have is painful in comparison. CONTRADICTION. You can't have painful memories in a realm where there is only joy for all eternity. Same with hell. If hell is a place of eternal pain and torment, you can't experience it that way because all sensations dwindle to zero over time. If you can never feel happiness again in this place of agony then any earthly memory will be pleasant in comparison. CONTRADICTION. You can't have pleasant memories in a realm where there is only sorrow for all eternity. While I have skipped over a lot of stuff to make this as concise as I dare, that is my argument in a nutshell.