YorkeDaddy

She hates trolling but does it herself, weak.

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Scarlett O'Hara

So telling you that you come on here to troll is trolling?

The Ascension, I don't think you are a misogynist but at the same time it's a bit strange having a man say what a woman should do with a bunch of cells.

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YorkeDaddy

I haven't been trolling at all, you're trying to stir me up for no reason. I've been nothing but polite and well-intentioned, so stop being petty and immature. It used to work, but it won't work on me anymore.

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The Ascension

As I said, it depends what one views the fetus as - a "bunch of cells", or a living being.

And I don't see what makes it strange. Abortion is a common issue. Are only women supposed to discuss the morality of it?

For the record, I am far closer to pro choice than pro life - but I feel as though my suggestion fulfills a bit of a compromise. I guess not.

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The Batlord

Regardless of how much I might agree with someone I think it's a bit reductionist to call a fetus "a bunch of cells". They are, obviously, but if that's all they were then I imagine it wouldn't be such an emotional event for a woman to abort one. A fetus is more than the sum of its parts in the mind of a person. They're the promise of a person. I mean I can't really think of a fetus without also thinking of a baby or a child. So I can understand people letting that get in the way of their logic when talking about abortion.

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Scarlett O'Hara

You've been accusing WhateverDude of things and suddenly now you're innocent? I have seen you do this so many times and it's really boring. How about posting like a normal member, not just coming here to create drama where there was none.

It's our bodies though, it's not a mans right to tell us whether having an abortion is lazy/unnecessary.

I agree that there is definitely an emotional part of having an abortion, but scientifically it's just cells up to a certain amount of weeks. It's down to the woman to make the decision, whether or not someone thinks its morally right or wrong.

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The Batlord

Sure but my point is that it's an emotional issue for everyone, so painting it as purely scientific when judging someone is unfair.

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Xurtio

You guys should stop talking about each other and discuss on the merits, try to stick to the subject matter. It helps avoid ****fights.

I agree. Overall I agree with Vanilla's stance that it's a woman's body and I'm pro-choice, etc, etc, but "scientifically it's just cells up to a certain amount of weeks" is kind of misleading. First of all, it's a moral discussion, so it's not directly relevant; there is a legitimate moral argument on behalf of pro-choice already being made, so it's not really necessary in this regard anyway. Second of all, science doesn't actually say it's "just cells" (key word just). They certainly say it is a clump of cells, but science doesn't take up a moral position, such as setting the threshold for when something is "just" a sea of quarks and leptons, rather than having some sort of significance, since meaning is susceptible to subjective opinions and environmental conditions.

That's not to say some scientists and scientific communities don't take moral positions. Often it can compromise their subjectivity though and their work becomes more political than scientific. But science is not scientists, of course.

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YorkeDaddy

And I've seen you contribute unnecessary vitriol to situations that don't call for it plenty of times. I was having a peaceful, friendly conversation with a member that I respect and there was zero reason for you to speak up and try to escalate things. No one was feeling insulted and I added a disclaimer that I find WD to be a great member to ensure that didn't happen. What you did (completely unprovoked) is called trolling. There was no drama until you intervened.

I know you're a mod and I'll give you the respect you deserve for that, but I really don't see a single thing I've done wrong and I think you were trying to stir things up which is something I won't do anymore. I've come back as a changed member, so just try to ignore your perceptions of me and give me a chance.

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John Wilkes Booth

scientifically it never stops being just cells. it's an arbitrary line you're trying to draw that doesn't actually exist.

i agree it's the woman's choice and i actually agree with abortion being legal. i'm just ok with humans being killed for the sake of reproductive control. but pro-choicers need to stop playing these silly word games.