I pretty much laid all conspiracy theories to rest and concluded that this kin of thinking was illogical, until I saw this. I had never heard of mk ultra before, it's very intriguing. And as you said, seems to be very well documented.

Oh good grief.

i don't have an argument that would stand up in court, if that's what you're asking. i've basically taken a year off of doing any research into this kind of stuff because (on top of being busy as hell) i don't really need to know any more to affirm that there are a group of malevolent string-pullers making the world entirely f*cked up. i say this because providing evidence would take some time, and i don't really want to get into it. but i've done enough reading and searching and finding to have come to this conclusion without the aid of mass media. apparently there is a doc out about the shooter in the batman killings though. i was explaining my viewpoint on the lack of reasoning behind these massacres the other day and was told that i should watch it, because it's apparently based entirely on the exact same logic that i arrived at myself. the guy has no recollection of doing what he did. he had no reason to do it. and unlike the recent school shooting, he didn't even kill himself. the people that do these things have no reason to do it. there is the argument that they are just severely depressed and rather than going out as a lonely nobody and blowing your own brains out, it means more to the world when you make a big deal about it; a logic which has ties to the sensationalized nature of events like these in the news media. i call that valid, but also note that when they kill themselves - which can be part of their programming - there is no one left to interview. have you ever seen an interview with the batman killer? didn't think so. and i bet it's a lot of work to keep reporters away from him.

i'm not saying that i think there are no sick people in the world. take charles manson for example. this guy is clearly messed up. and the news media are unrestricted in displaying that to the world. he's also extremely intelligent, and that combined with his sickness has lead to what he genuinely believes are sound motives for his actions. again, because he is truly sick, the media is free to exploit it to the people of the world. no such thing is happening with the current slew of mass killers.

as far as lsd goes, i'm not saying that i think what's going on here is directly related to using it as a tool to control people. like i said, it's been quite some time since i've immersed myself in this type of stuff. i brought up mk ultra because it was essentially the touchstone for the US governments' experiments in mind control. of course i'm aware of edward bernays (freud's nephew) and his huge influence on the actions of the mad men via mass psychology. i also know a lot about the Nazi party's minister of propaganda joseph goebbels. shaping public opinion is a big f*ckin deal. but to paraphrase your statement freebase, in shaping that public opinion you give people a sense that their opinions are their own. this can serve as a distraction to a great degree of efficacy, especially when you give them things to argue about.

so basically, i don't think lsd has any direct correlation with that what's going on here. perhaps mk ultra was the wrong tag line for what i'm trying to get at. "machurian candidate" is likely more apt. and no, i've never seen the movie.

Yeah, nothing screams "reality" like a 1950s thriller starring Frank Sinatra.

How do we differ the brainwashed from the unbrainwashed and crazy then? And how do you know I'm not currently being controlled to organise MB meet up and shoot ya'll asses for no reason then proclaim I don't remember it? I've looked up Mk ultra but I have yet to read any of it. Before I read it I think it's really quite naive to believe the conspiracy theory, I mean how do they brainwash people? Do they kidnap you and do it? Or do they arrange weekly appointments so your family don't notice you missing :laughing:?

you say it's naive to believe it without reading it, then you end with a little laughing man implying that the whole idea is ridiculous without having read up on it. i'm confused as to your derivation of meaning concerning the definition of the word "naive."

you ask questions that would probably be answered if you went beyond just looking it up and went on to do some reading. personally, i don't understand the concept of looking something up and then not reading it. is it a matter of just seeing if i've created a work of fiction here?

needless to say, i'm not going to hijack this post. i just thought it might worth noting that there may be more to this issue than the not so simple questions concerning gun control.

Mk ultra isn't really a conspiracy theory, is it? It seems like there is pretty concrete evidence on the subject.

it's definitely not a conspiracy theory. neither are manchurian candidates.

The Manchurian Candidate is a work of fiction, not reality.

i disagree. i've seen and read interviews with programmers.

There are five billion and one things to "look up" in this world like conspiracy theories, religion, scientific advancements, philosophy, etc, etc, etc. I prefer to spend my time on things NOT endorsed solely by George Noory listening whackadoos. If I miss some things on the way, I guess that's the price I pay for not wasting my time on 99% of the other nonsense that they like to harp on about.

try the taglines "monarch slaves" or "monarch mind control"

edit: i have no idea who george noory is. and i also find it very strange that now two people claiming this is bullsh*t are saying they simply refuse to look it up. very strange indeed.

You can disagree all you want, it doesn't change the fact that The Manchurian Candidate is a novel and two films based on it, all of them works of fiction.

semantics. see tags above.

Semantics? No, facts. The Manchurian Candidate is indeed a work of fiction.

I don't think zevokes is talking about the movie. Of
Course that is a work of fiction, I think he's talking about real instances of "manchurian candidates".

ugh. look up the tags man. manchurian candidate is the popularized term for what im talking about. there happens to be works of fiction created about those ideas, yes. it doesn't take anything away from what i'm talking about. or, you can not look up the tags and claim that some guy on the internet believes everything he's seen in the movies he never watched.

I have no idea what that last sentence means, but okay now I see you're using the name of a work of fiction to describe your conspiracy theories. That doesn't exactly win me over to believing said conspiracy theory is a fact though. Nor does the fact that after googling "monarch slaves" I'm bombarded by a bunch links that appear to be nonsense.

I did a quick read on monarch slaves and I must say, it sounded bogus. I still think the whole mk ultra thing is pretty legit.

I think the whole thing with conspiracy theories is they're often based on something that's real in some way but then inflated and exaggerated to the point of absurdity.

Thanks mate but I think I know what it means. I said it was naive because I hardly think the government is an organised gang brainwashing the victims of all worldwide tragedies and I'm giving you my opinion before I read any articles but I don't think I will bother afterwards.

I also posted a laughing smiley because I am FUN. You should try it sometime. It's apparently good.



Edit: I think I went overboard with the government, my bad.

For example: zevokes trying to draw a parallel between a government sanctioned experiment from the 50s-60's.... and Sandy Hook :crazy:

So, have neither one of you read anything about mk ultra?

What makes you think the program was ever legitimately ended?

Wikipedia

What makes you think I care if it was? Your speculation for how it relates to Sandy Hook is just that, speculation.


Attributing Sandy Hook to a government experiment is nothing more than a reaffirmation of some people's deep-seated distrust of authority

Correction: I never said there was any relation there.

For all we know maybe he was a "manchurian candidate" used to push the government agenda of banning guns in order to render society defenseless against a government overthrow.

I don't believe that, but it's possible. Don't think a government is capable of such evil things? History says otherwise. If it happened once, who's to say it can't happen again?

The main thing destroying America right now is the lack of gun control, and the joke of 20 gun stores in the ghetto has proven just as potent as ever since the 80s. Many attribute that to the wished destruction of the American minority.

That's the main thing destroying America? I find that hard to believe.

Oh well not the main thing but it is allowing school shootings and snappy homicides to take place more frequently than they would minus so many guns in so residences.

There is an alternative reality about America that some people refuse to believe is false. Despite the giant slap of reality we got back in November.

I think violence itself is a much bigger problem than guns.

George Noory took the place of Art Bell on Coast to Coast. They pretty much cover everything and anything that falls into the paranormal: Crop Circles, Aliens, Ghosts, and Conspiracy Theories. The best guest they had on was a guy who wrote about all the strange coincidences between the deaths of different Rock stars, e.g. Joe Meek died on the same day as Buddy Holly died, (and how a bunch of people who were conneceted with Buddy died also) and Dimebag Darrell was assassinated on the same day as John Lennon.

If it weren't for carbon molecules, none of this would have ever happened.

Why is the father of one of the girls laughing before he makes his statement?


The Daily Digest - Sandy Hook Actor Getting Into Character - YouTube

Yea that's a little weird.

Here's the whole vid:


Anyone here have any sort of reasonable explanation, or is this normal behavior?

Well it certainly isn't normal, and I am starting to feel a little sick. Something is not right. It is like he is acting...

:laughing:

I'll get around to responding to your post at some point FD, I've been pretty busy lately

I won't propose to know what goes through the mind of a father who lost his child, but I too agree that it's not really the kind of state of mind you'd expect someone in his position to be in. I guess that naturally leads people to exploration of alternative explanations, any of which could be right or wrong. I'd suggest digging into the issue as much as possible before actually jumping to any conclusions.
But yea, at its face, his behavior is highly suspect, to me. If I were going to make a leap, the first place I'd jump to is one of those personalities that loves the spotlight and doesn't really feel any real emotion. I guess if he was a psychopath, that would be way more realistic than some of the other explanations I could come up with.

Don't worry about it man. I was super drunk. I just like fighting a cause when I'm drunk. :)

I have given up jumping to conclusions on any of the crazy **** that goes on over in America politically and socially. I honestly don't know what or who to believe or trust anymore.