Children killed in Connecticut school shooting (likely 27 dead,including 18 children)

**Janszoon** · 12-14-2012, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Engine

Haha, okay let's slow down and get rational. You (Janszoon) implied those things. And I understand why. My response remains the same ("he" being FD).

Give me a minute to read your last post that responded to mine for a minute. I'm kind of slow.

It's okay. It's midnight and I don't really feel like arguing with people I like about things I don't feel strongly about. I'll be in the shouty talking nonsense.

Freebase Dali · 12-14-2012, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuna

It really goes for any kind of spree killing where 99% of the time it ends up being the cops who take down the perpetrator.

There's two ways of looking at it obviously
-stricter gun control
-less gun control

Is #2 really a path we want to take? Fighting violence with violence, basically turning the U.S. into a hostile war zone of it's own, where everyone is so on edge that they feel the need to carry a gun on themselves at all times to be safe? Doesn't sound like a very hospitable environment to me.

An armed guard would potentially work, but at the same time it takes, what, 1 minute to gun down an entire classroom of people?

Well, to only see those two options as being valid to pursue sorta doesn't make very much of an argument, because I definitely don't think those are the only options that could fit on the table.
Making it harder to obtain firearms is somewhere in the middle, and it should be pursued vigorously, as that option lessens the chances of the wrong people obtaining them while not eliminating the chances of the right people obtaining them.

As far as an armed guard not really working because it could take 1 minute to kill a classroom, I gotta think you're intentionally not actually considering this discussion seriously. Tell you what. If you can come up with a plan to somehow figure out how to install an armed security guard in such a way as to actually prevent an armed 20 year old from entering a class room and killing all the students, you win.

Winning means your previous post is contradicted. Not winning means you're not very bright.

Bloozcrooz · 12-14-2012, 11:34 PM

Ok I'm back, has everyone settled upon an agreement?

Hitch · 12-14-2012, 11:42 PM

The killer had used a semi-automatic rifle. There could be laws at least to keep those highly restricted or even banned, no? Yeah, it'll still be available illegally given the number of guns already in circulation, but reinstating the ban might be a start. I find it hard to foresee that the 2nd Amendment might have had these weapons in mind...Plus, self defense aside, I can quite accurately picture what kind of threat the founding fathers wanted to protect themselves against with an armed militia (the threat of which, after centuries of democratic governance, is nonexistent now).

Bloozcrooz · 12-14-2012, 11:48 PM

Ban all guns and hope they disappear from the criminal element as well or legalize them totally so that everyone can protect themselves at all times in wild west fashion. Is that the two options this has narrowed down to?

ThePhanastasio · 12-14-2012, 11:56 PM

I hate these poor, innocent childrens' deaths being used as something of a pawn by people to further their own political agenda. I also hate the reporting on the shooting, describing it repeatedly as the "second deadliest school shooting in American history."

**** that. That is reducing this to statistics, reducing this to another tragedy to lump in with all the others, using, "second deadliest," as a kind of macabre measuring stick, like it's some kind of qualification.

There are dead children just before Christmas whose lives were taken from them by a complete psychopath, who won't get to leave cookies for Santa this year, open their presents, light their menorahs, or whatever their holiday tradition.

These are people. These are children, teachers, mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, friends...they're not pawns or statistics in some ****ing political debate. These innocent people aren't even in the ground yet, and they're being overshadowed by gun control advocates and their counterparts, shouting out opinions on a hot button political issue instead of mourning the loss of life.

Taking a step back, it seems like there's a shocking lack of empathy showing from the news media and the buzz on social media.

That's all I'm going to say on the issue. RIP to those poor souls whose lives were taken today.

Rjinn · 12-15-2012, 12:45 AM

I don't get why so many school shootings happen in the States? It's absolutely abhorrent and I really do think the government needs to start thinking about offering some sort of protection to schools.

My god, primary school children? I can't fathom how that would ever make sense, or anyone who could be so void of a conscience.

blastingas10 · 12-15-2012, 01:03 AM

I really am neutral on the subject even If I may seem pro-gun. I just think that steps to tighten up on laws should really be thought out before going straight to banning all guns. Put some kind of limit on how many guns can be manufactured by gun manufacturers. That would instantly cut down on the guns in circulation. Hell, ban gun manufacturing, just don't go taking guns from respectable citizens who already own them. There has to be some things that can be done to decrease the gun-murder rate without a ban on guns.

Bloozcrooz · 12-15-2012, 01:59 AM

Either ban guns or legalize them for everyone. Situation resolved

Guybrush · 12-15-2012, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blastingas10

Aren't you from Norway, tore? This info could be a couple years old but I read that Norway has one of the highest rates of gun ownership in Western Europe, yet possesses the lowest murder rate. And Holland has one of the highest murder rates, despite have one of the lowest gun ownership rates.

I am and we do? I guess Scandinavia in general has high gun ownership compared to the rest of Europe, but the firearms culture is not about using firearms for defence or as a means to rise up against our government should the need arise (thinking of bloozcrooz here). The reason there's a relatively lot of guns here is because most of Norway is trees and forests or other sorts of nature with wild animals in it and so there are a lot of hunters here.

In order to get that gun, you need to get a hunting license which includes firearm training and then the guns you buy (rifles or shotguns) are the sort designed to help you put a wild animal on your plate, not defend you against humans.

I've never met anyone who bought a firearm for personal protection. Well, not against anything other than polar bears anyways.

edit :

I looked up the numbers and it does seem Norway scores relatively high on guns per amount of people for a European country. According to this source (came up randomly) there are 31.3 guns in Norway per hundred people. In the same list, United States has 88.8 guns per hundred people which is a lot more.

12-14-2012, 11:56 PM	#136 (permalink)
ThePhanastasio Killed Laura Palmer Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Ashland, KY Posts: 1,679	I hate these poor, innocent childrens' deaths being used as something of a pawn by people to further their own political agenda. I also hate the reporting on the shooting, describing it repeatedly as the "second deadliest school shooting in American history." ** that. That is reducing this to statistics, reducing this to another tragedy to lump in with all the others, using, "second deadliest," as a kind of macabre measuring stick, like it's some kind of qualification. There are dead children just before Christmas whose lives were taken from them by a complete psychopath, who won't get to leave cookies for Santa this year, open their presents, light their menorahs, or whatever their holiday tradition. These are people. These are children, teachers, mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, friends...they're not pawns or statistics in some **ing political debate. These innocent people aren't even in the ground yet, and they're being overshadowed by gun control advocates and their counterparts, shouting out opinions on a hot button political issue instead of mourning the loss of life. Taking a step back, it seems like there's a shocking lack of empathy showing from the news media and the buzz on social media. That's all I'm going to say on the issue. RIP to those poor souls whose lives were taken today. __________________ Phish: Studio Discography Reviewed 100 Albums I Heartily Recommend My last.fm It's a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken Perhaps they're better left unsung

12-15-2012, 12:45 AM	#137 (permalink)
Rjinn The Aerosol in your Soul Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: New South Wales, Australia Posts: 1,546	I don't get why so many school shootings happen in the States? It's absolutely abhorrent and I really do think the government needs to start thinking about offering some sort of protection to schools. My god, primary school children? I can't fathom how that would ever make sense, or anyone who could be so void of a conscience. __________________ last.fm Last edited by Rjinn; 12-15-2012 at 07:37 AM.

12-14-2012, 11:42 PM	#134 (permalink)
Hitch Music Addict Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 80	The killer had used a semi-automatic rifle. There could be laws at least to keep those highly restricted or even banned, no? Yeah, it'll still be available illegally given the number of guns already in circulation, but reinstating the ban might be a start. I find it hard to foresee that the 2nd Amendment might have had these weapons in mind...Plus, self defense aside, I can quite accurately picture what kind of threat the founding fathers wanted to protect themselves against with an armed militia (the threat of which, after centuries of democratic governance, is nonexistent now).

12-15-2012, 01:03 AM	#138 (permalink)
blastingas10 Music Addict Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 2,126	I really am neutral on the subject even If I may seem pro-gun. I just think that steps to tighten up on laws should really be thought out before going straight to banning all guns. Put some kind of limit on how many guns can be manufactured by gun manufacturers. That would instantly cut down on the guns in circulation. Hell, ban gun manufacturing, just don't go taking guns from respectable citizens who already own them. There has to be some things that can be done to decrease the gun-murder rate without a ban on guns.