Dr_Rez

Well Im under the impression thus far into life that good and bad is not inherant in people. They are shaped by the environment around them. Perhaps some are more likely to be one or the other but ultimately environments determine everything about a person.

If free will isnt the case then wouldnt that prove this anyways?

Honestly I dont think anyone ACTUALLY 100% believes their is no free will. If so you wouldnt continue with your life. you would just sit there waiting for life to come to you.

__________________
*Best chance of losing virginity is in prison crew*
*Always Checks Credentials Crew*
*nba > nfl crew*
*Shave one of my legs to pretend its a girl in my bed crew*

midnight rain

I think most people are smart enough to realize that that's not how lack of free will works

Dr_Rez

You see what Im getting at though. If makes any decisions in your life almost meaningless. I mean what thought process would you have if you already have picked somehting.

To quote the Matrix when the Oricale speaks to Neo she says "We are here to understand why we made the choice."

Perhaps thats what you mean?

__________________
*Best chance of losing virginity is in prison crew*
*Always Checks Credentials Crew*
*nba > nfl crew*
*Shave one of my legs to pretend its a girl in my bed crew*

TheBig3

Sure it does. You'd sit there until you needed to eat or **** or bathe or something and you'd get up. And then maybe you'd trip and break a bone in your hand and you'd have to go to the hospital. There'd you'd fall in love with your nurse. You'd propose on the spot and you'd fly home on your magic carpet.

Free will does not exist.

__________________
I've moved to a new address

The Batlord

@ Big3

I just want to ask, as a thought experiment, in a universe where everything is mathematically calculable, from the way a pool ball bounces off the side of a pool table, to the way a planet moves on it's orbit, to the way a forest grows (through fractal mathematics), how can human consciousness somehow be immune to being mathematically calculable? Because for free will to exist, human consciousness must somehow be immune to mathematics.

__________________

Howard the Duck

certain elements in quantum mechanics, like eigenstates, defy conventional mathematics, so that might be a scientific principle for "free will"

i don't buy it, though

__________________


Malaise is THE dominant human predilection.

TheBig3

This is good politics, but its not good science. Humans are just as susceptible to gravity and trajectory as anything else. The primary difference is, and why people conclude there is free will, is that higher levels of logic and reason - which are self-determined - create new trajectories and drive.

To say we're creatures of society and therefore we have no freewill maybe correct to a small degree, but society was created from free will. Many things run anathema to what Tuna is suggesting is just good business.

Why do I donate to charities? Lets say I give you a gift from OxFam, which is a gift that says "you just bought a goat for a village in Cambodia." Theres no benefit to you, and you don't see the benefit to the village.

To suggest that the universe is Math is to say buildings are all structure. Theres art in their, friend, and that art is determined by a non-functional need to achieve ones own pleasant desires.

__________________
I've moved to a new address

midnight rain

Peace of mind? The joy in knowing that you helped someone less fortunate than you?

Hedonism?

The Batlord

What the fuck do you think they're doing with the goat?!

__________________

Howard the Duck

stop asking the obvious

__________________


Malaise is THE dominant human predilection.