War on Christmas

MoonlitSunshine · 12-11-2011, 10:52 AM

In certain places in the world, yes, tradition is truly under threat. It's like... You're from ireland, remember the last general election (the one before last) where "everyone" was sure that Fianna Fáil weren't going to get back into government and then the results came in and they were nowhere near losing? Sometimes it's easy to get disillusioned on the grand scale by the similar opinions of your peers.

It's definitely true to say that there are many areas of the world where Political Correctness and/or Fundamentalism are being taken too far. It's also definitely true to say that most people, picked out from a crowd and asked if they really believe etc. etc., would agree with sensibility rather than ridiculousness, but the ridiculousness still happens. The simple fact that a growing number of places feel it's no longer politically correct to say "Merry Christmas" to me screams of the growing problem of merged globalisation.

But hey, I may be overreacting. I may be feeling assaulted by other cultures, I may be feeling that my own culture is being treated as second rate to those which are immigrating to my area - why is it right that I should have to be careful what I say around them, but they can demand that we allow for their ways? But that is another discussion for another day. If it were just a name change, and attempt to secularise a tradition which is much less about religion and more about family and friends, I might feel differently, but I just feel that this is a symptom of a greater problem, it's part of the erosion of tradition and culture, and personally, I'm damned if I'm not going to take a stand on it.

~~Rubato~~ · 12-11-2011, 11:20 AM

It's their culture that we're "importing" so yes our culture needs to make way for them, I wouldn't say our culture is being treated as second rate. I've no objection to those being cautious to the change, there will be growing pains and people tend to play it too safe.

hip hop bunny hop · 12-11-2011, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electrophonic Tonic

As for the nativity scene... on private property, I have no problem with it. Completely protected under the 1st Amendment. But on a courthouse lawn, that's a problem. Again, back to the 1st, but government shall not establish a religion. I believe on a courthouse lawn it does, even if indirectly.

Sort of. The 1st Amendment, originally, only prohibited the Federal Government from doing so.

When it comes to State/Local Governments, what's preventing them are the Civil War Amendments, the changing interpretation of these amendments and how it changed these State/Local Governments relationship to the Bill of Rights. LINK to Wikipedia Article on the 14th Amendment & LINK to the Incorporation Clause.

If that's TL;DR for you: thanks to the changing interpretation of the 14th amendment, State Govts (etc.) have to follow the Bill of Rights in the same manner as the Federal Government.

Urban Hat€monger ? · 12-11-2011, 12:44 PM

The only problem I have with 'Happy Holidays' is that nobody ever says that at any other time of the year for any other public holiday.
So if you're just going to say that at Christmas, why not just say happy Christmas.

If I went somewhere predominately Jewish and someone wished me a happy Hanukkah, I'm not going to take offense to it because I'm not Jewish, they're just being polite and to be honest I'd quite like to think I'd be happy on that day whether I celebrate Hanukkah or not.

Salami · 12-11-2011, 12:50 PM

I agree with that. I doubt most Jewish or Muslim people are offended by being wished "Happy Christmas". For them I'm sure it's merely a foreign greeting.

And I would like to be wished "happy Hanukkah" more often. I like observing Jewish festivals as much as Christian ones. There isn't really anything offensive about it.

**Goofle** · 12-11-2011, 06:33 PM

Most Jewish/Muslim people I know say "Happy Christmas" to me. No biggie.

Stephen · 12-11-2011, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomClancy11

Most Jewish/Muslim people I know say "Happy Christmas" to me. No biggie.

I find the biggest ****-stirrers on such issues are the westerners who have recently converted and take it on themselves to represent the rest of their acquired culture.

TheBig3 · 12-11-2011, 09:47 PM

America took the hit for Europe by drinking up all the religious nut-bags. You couldn't have really assumed a different outcome.

**Goofle** · 12-11-2011, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fazstp

I find the biggest ****-stirrers on such issues are the westerners who have recently converted and take it on themselves to represent the rest of their acquired culture.

Exactly, there should not be an acquired culture. Causes too many problems.

~~Odyshape~~ · 12-14-2011, 08:33 PM

Are people really upset about the use of the word Christmas or are news station just running out of ideas. I have never ever heard of any person being offended by some one wishing them a merry Christmas. Why should they?! Its reached a point where its barely even a religious term anymore and the only people who would get upset about it are pedantic.

12-11-2011, 10:52 AM	#31 (permalink)
MoonlitSunshine Dat's Der Bunny! Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Ireland Posts: 1,088	In certain places in the world, yes, tradition is truly under threat. It's like... You're from ireland, remember the last general election (the one before last) where "everyone" was sure that Fianna Fáil weren't going to get back into government and then the results came in and they were nowhere near losing? Sometimes it's easy to get disillusioned on the grand scale by the similar opinions of your peers. It's definitely true to say that there are many areas of the world where Political Correctness and/or Fundamentalism are being taken too far. It's also definitely true to say that most people, picked out from a crowd and asked if they really believe etc. etc., would agree with sensibility rather than ridiculousness, but the ridiculousness still happens. The simple fact that a growing number of places feel it's no longer politically correct to say "Merry Christmas" to me screams of the growing problem of merged globalisation. But hey, I may be overreacting. I may be feeling assaulted by other cultures, I may be feeling that my own culture is being treated as second rate to those which are immigrating to my area - why is it right that I should have to be careful what I say around them, but they can demand that we allow for their ways? But that is another discussion for another day. If it were just a name change, and attempt to secularise a tradition which is much less about religion and more about family and friends, I might feel differently, but I just feel that this is a symptom of a greater problem, it's part of the erosion of tradition and culture, and personally, I'm damned if I'm not going to take a stand on it. __________________ "I found it eventually, at the bottom of a locker in a disused laboratory, with a sign on the door saying "Beware of the Leopard". Ever thought of going into Advertising?" - Arthur Dent

12-11-2011, 12:44 PM	#34 (permalink)
Urban Hat€monger ? The Sexual Intellectual Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere cooler than you Posts: 18,605	The only problem I have with 'Happy Holidays' is that nobody ever says that at any other time of the year for any other public holiday. So if you're just going to say that at Christmas, why not just say happy Christmas. If I went somewhere predominately Jewish and someone wished me a happy Hanukkah, I'm not going to take offense to it because I'm not Jewish, they're just being polite and to be honest I'd quite like to think I'd be happy on that day whether I celebrate Hanukkah or not. __________________ Urb's RYM Stuff Most people sell their soul to the devil, but the devil sells his soul to Nick Cave.

12-11-2011, 09:47 PM	#38 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	America took the hit for Europe by drinking up all the religious nut-bags. You couldn't have really assumed a different outcome. __________________ I've moved to a new address

12-11-2011, 11:20 AM	#32 (permalink)
~~Rubato~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Ireland Posts: 230	It's their culture that we're "importing" so yes our culture needs to make way for them, I wouldn't say our culture is being treated as second rate. I've no objection to those being cautious to the change, there will be growing pains and people tend to play it too safe.

12-11-2011, 12:50 PM	#35 (permalink)
Salami Get in ma belly Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Derbyshire Posts: 1,385	I agree with that. I doubt most Jewish or Muslim people are offended by being wished "Happy Christmas". For them I'm sure it's merely a foreign greeting. And I would like to be wished "happy Hanukkah" more often. I like observing Jewish festivals as much as Christian ones. There isn't really anything offensive about it.

12-14-2011, 08:33 PM	#40 (permalink)
~~Odyshape~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 526	Are people really upset about the use of the word Christmas or are news station just running out of ideas. I have never ever heard of any person being offended by some one wishing them a merry Christmas. Why should they?! Its reached a point where its barely even a religious term anymore and the only people who would get upset about it are pedantic.