lolbertarians

~~Rubato~~ · 12-17-2011, 06:09 PM

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Originally Posted by Paloma

Not only that, but he wants to, again, end birthright citizenship. Why?

Rethinking Birthright Citizenship by Ron Paul

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A recent article in the Houston Chronicle discusses the problem of so-called anchor babies, children born in U.S. hospitals to illegal immigrant parents. These children automatically become citizens, and thus serve as an anchor for their parents to remain in the country. Our immigration authorities understandably are reluctant to break up families by deporting parents of young babies. But birthright citizenship, originating in the 14th amendment, has become a serious cultural and economic dilemma for our nation.

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Make no mistake, Americans are happy to welcome immigrants who follow our immigration laws and seek a better life here. America is far more welcoming and tolerant of newcomers than virtually any nation on earth. But our modern welfare state creates perverse incentives for immigrants, incentives that cloud the issue of why people choose to come here. The real problem is not immigration, but rather the welfare state magnet.

It's a bandy way to try solve the problem and there's some of the usual bitching about taxes but it's not racially motivated.

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America is far more welcoming and tolerant of newcomers than virtually any nation on earth. But our modern welfare state creates perverse incentives for immigrants, incentives that cloud the issue of why people choose to come here.

and yes I too find this laughable.

~~Sansa Stark~~ · 12-17-2011, 06:18 PM

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Originally Posted by TheBig3

...What?

I don't know what leap you're making there, but let me put it this way. If you're going to say the word "racist", which generally means that one race is inherently superior to another, then you'd best be certain thats what you're dealing with.

He's preaching Free-Market principles for everything. Its otherwise known as Ideology. Ideology is often bad because it has one prescription for every problem. But as misguided as he might be on this issue, I don't think that means he thinks Black folks just aren't as smart as white people.

And thats what you're saying, and its not accurate. As for birth right citizenship, I don't know why he is against it (If he is, this is the first i've heard of it) but I'm sure his website will tell you. It doesn't seem to add up though because jus soli is a founding principle and he's also someone who's got a really loose freetrade policy so if you find out, let me know.

What do you think the default "American" is? Inevitably it will always mean adopting the culture of white people. Obviously, that would put that culture above all others.

Do you want more examples...?

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“Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5 percent of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty and the end of welfare and affirmative action.”

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“Given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the `criminal justice system,’ I think we can safely assume that 95 percent of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal.”

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"There is no such thing as a hate crime, only crimes against person and property."

so on

I'm reading his website now and I'm just repulsed

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And during his years in medicine, never once did he find an abortion necessary to save the life of a pregnant woman.

Because Ron Paul's experience should speak for all women?

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Because he agrees with Thomas Jefferson that it is “sinful and tyrannical” to “compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors,” Ron Paul will also protect the American people’s freedom of conscience by working to prohibit taxpayer funds from being used for abortions, Planned Parenthood, or any other so-called “family planning” program.

The Hyde Amendment prohibits federal funding for abortions and it's been around since 1976.

And here's a graph of what PP actually does.

TheBig3 · 12-17-2011, 06:18 PM

Thanks, Rubato. I'll take a scan through now. But if in fact the free healthcare is why immigrants come here is his argument then yes, this is nonsense.

But this raises a good point in general, and one I think Sam was making (Correct me if I'm wrong, Sam) but with all the candidates out there, at least Paul has a plan. As I've said, its hard for me to imagine myself not voting for Obama in the general, but with this crop of GOP candidates, Paul might be the most intellectually honest, and spiritually (political sense) truthful candidate. Its going to be very hard for the GOP to un**** itself if they run someone like Newt, so Paul should be considered more strongly.

TheBig3 · 12-17-2011, 06:24 PM

Paloma, I'm not going to quote you because thats going to be a cluster**** on the page, but you still seem (to me) to be talking massive leaps. I don't know where the phrase "default american" is coming from, but wherever its coming from I don't think the dominant culture in America would be considered "white."

For one thing, its very hard to define "white culture." And secondly, America's melting pot status is most prevalent in culture, as opposed to class or income disparity.

In trying to make heads from tails in your post (not your fault necessarily) I'd say this. There might be a great deal of systemic racism in this country (argument for another thread) that doesn't mean that Paul is racist, or that his policies are racist. If anything, a Ron Paul presidency would likely slash systemic racism since a great deal of the "corrections system" has to do with drug-related charges, an issue he seeks to eliminate wholly.

12-17-2011, 06:18 PM	#73 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	Thanks, Rubato. I'll take a scan through now. But if in fact the free healthcare is why immigrants come here is his argument then yes, this is nonsense. But this raises a good point in general, and one I think Sam was making (Correct me if I'm wrong, Sam) but with all the candidates out there, at least Paul has a plan. As I've said, its hard for me to imagine myself not voting for Obama in the general, but with this crop of GOP candidates, Paul might be the most intellectually honest, and spiritually (political sense) truthful candidate. Its going to be very hard for the GOP to un**** itself if they run someone like Newt, so Paul should be considered more strongly. __________________ I've moved to a new address

12-17-2011, 06:24 PM	#74 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	Paloma, I'm not going to quote you because thats going to be a cluster**** on the page, but you still seem (to me) to be talking massive leaps. I don't know where the phrase "default american" is coming from, but wherever its coming from I don't think the dominant culture in America would be considered "white." For one thing, its very hard to define "white culture." And secondly, America's melting pot status is most prevalent in culture, as opposed to class or income disparity. In trying to make heads from tails in your post (not your fault necessarily) I'd say this. There might be a great deal of systemic racism in this country (argument for another thread) that doesn't mean that Paul is racist, or that his policies are racist. If anything, a Ron Paul presidency would likely slash systemic racism since a great deal of the "corrections system" has to do with drug-related charges, an issue he seeks to eliminate wholly. __________________ I've moved to a new address