How many people here have read the major religious texts of the major religions?
 

This is a question which has likely been done to death, but a search turned up nothing.

I'm just wondering, with all the religious discussion on here, how many people have actually read the holy books of other religions to their own (if they have a religious ID at all) or studied the culture, theology and background to those religions.

It just seems that there's an awful lot of misunderstanding going on about some religions (especially Islam) which could be sorted out by some basic research into that religion or that particular theology.

I can say that I've read most of the major religious texts, including some in their original language.

What about my fellow MBers?

Nope. The religions I'm most curious about are those that relate to my heritage; which would be Hinduism, Christianity, European pagan religions (specifically the germanic), and - to a lesser extent - Judaism.

Regarding ignorance of Islam, there certainly is no shortage of it, but I'd say it's mostly on the side of it's apologists. LINK <---**** like that, to me, is disgusting.

Read bits of Leviticus just to see the ****ed up things the bible actually tells people to do. Same with Dueteronomy.

Honestly, I'd love to, but I never can bring myself to read them. Most religions tend to have a smaller pile of total crap spread amongst their bigger pile of good stuff, and every time I hit that crap I just give up.

Not even Orthodox Jews keep some of the rules in those two books, especially with regard to stuff which carries the death penalty.

Well, it'd require them to be genocidally homophobic which even if they wanted to, they couldn't get away with in the modern world.

I have read many in my 50 yrs on earth and I can proudly say I am as confused as when I started . . . LOL!

Nope. All I can say that I've done is read up on the misconceptions surrounding some of them, and then read the relevant parts that originally caused all the controversy. That's about it really.

Perhaps I should, but I have no real desire to. It all looks like crap to me, and I've never met anyone who made me think otherwise. I guess it's like getting shot. I've never been shot so I don't technically know how it feels, but I don't have any desire to find out either.

Not only that, but the system of the mitzvot, some of which are only specific to some people, would mean you'd have to be male, female, a Levi (essentially a priest), a Cohen (another type of priest with claim to direct descendency from Aaron) and a Yisraelim (a term for anyone considered Jewish) all at the same time (and these groups have within them restrictions and priveliges all of their own).

I believe I've read every major religious text, but i'm kind of obsessive about that ****.

i have read the Bible in a few versions - original King James, NIV and Good News version (modern simple English)

i have read the Quran in a literature-style translation (non-religious) and straight literal from its Arabic text (religious)

the problem is that every one who believes in Christ most of them haven't red the Bible,
everyone who believes in Krishna haven't red the Bhagavad Gita, it's hard to imagine how they deal with their imaginable truth" of holy books if they just don't know what they are about ? i started reading them, getting close, then i started reading esoteric and theosofical ones, like Lobsang Rampa and Madam Blavatsky. I wanted to say more but i don't have the rights )

i only really have one religious text i believe in - The Transmigration of Timothy Archer by Philip K. Dick - it's the be-all and end-all of Gnostic Christianity

RE: GeddyBass
 

I must say that I have read just about everything there is to read. And, not exclusive to all the major religious texts. Truth is everywhere. In every Word ever written. So, I guess I would like to know what you have learned from your studies? Do you understand the concepts. Logos. Do you understand the Book of Tao? Or, even Mary had a little lamb?

Can you pinpoint Truth in the messages delivered through the brilliance of lyricists in rock n roll?

Let me post a song I wrote. The lyrics apply to a few problems. Let me know how many messages do you find that apply to everything you know through all the texts you have studied? And, the last line. What is the name?

The Score

In this world of numbers and digits
an endless supply of useless statistics
winning or losing the game of life
means life for your death, and death for your life
The powers that be love their numbers and digits
utilized for handy labeling kits
manipulation of numbers create deception and lies
And, with the labeling kits, they destroy men's lives

So they tabulate to stipulate
and recalculate to manipulate
but sadly they underestimate
the fate they await on the Judgment date
and all the numbers and digits that these men create
serve only to abominate, desecrate, and teach us to hate

In this world of numbers and digits
and labels created to suit us and fit us
to categorize us as an end to a means
And, we wear them as proudly as designer jeans

So they tabulate and calculate
to manipulate and validate
to amass a wealth that bears no weight
for bread that means nothing at the narrow gate
and on the great and dreadful judgment date
nary a man can manipulate his fate
because, judging oneself is a tough debate
The Powers that be want conformity
with numbers and digits they form strategy
and we follow along like little lost sheep
to be bound in a place called gnash and weep
Numbers and digits is the name of the game
But numbers and digits cannot form a name
and in this game there is no hero
cause man's final score is always on zero
So keep on following on the broad and wide path
use numbers and digits and keep crooked math
Use those numbers and digits for your son and daughter
for with numbers and digits you lead them to slaughter

So stand by while they calculate and tabulate
the numbers used to manipulate and dominate
and while numbers and digits for some seem to stimulate
death and destruction is what they perpetuate
by man's actions and words he seals his own fate
for numbers and digits not a single name makes

Because, this is exactly why I joined this site. Is to try to inform people that they must do exactly what you have done and more. If they want to seek and find what is incorrectly perceived as a name. god. And, the religions created from the messages of Logos that were altered and misinterpreted.

See what you think might the message here. There's several that apply to all the scriptures, and the teachings. How many can we find? I hope some of you participate, and please post anything you would want to see interpreted. I would love to see some original poetry, or songs you have written.

peace

steve

Welcome to MB, Steve. http://i485.photobucket.com/albums/r...999/drinks.gif

Try this one:

I’m sure that I will always be
A lonely number like root three

The three is all that’s good and right,
Why must my three keep out of sight
Beneath the vicious square root sign,
I wish instead I were a nine

For nine could thwart this evil trick,
with just some quick arithmetic

I know I’ll never see the sun, as 1.7321
Such is my reality, a sad irrationality

When hark! What is this I see,
Another square root of a three

As quietly co-waltzing by,
Together now we multiply
To form a number we prefer,
Rejoicing as an integer

We break free from our mortal bonds
With the wave of magic wands

Our square root signs become unglued
Your love for me has been renewed

[The Square Root of Three by David Feinberg]

Too easy?

RE: How many people here have read the major religious texts of the major religions?
 

skaltezon wrote:
Thank you for the welcome my brother.

Actually it is not easy for anyone who does not know Logos. And, the concept of worship as it 'defined'. So, allow me share a couple of Words that prevent David Feinburg from seeing any thing beyond the Sun. And, Logos was with god and is god. And, the Word is the Name, and the Name can only be known. Those who have the Name know it, but, do not speak it. And, those who do not have it, do not know it.

But, when it says 'father', think Mother. It is not Dad and Mom, is it not Mom and Dad?

Here is David's problem. Worship. "to become an worthy of equal state of being. Indivisible, having nothing with which to measure it. Exist yet not exist at the same time, so that it satisfies a theist, and A-theist.

And, perfectly at rest defying the laws of motion. Since, an object tends to stay in motion, unless affected by an unbalanced force, we have to become an object that cannot be affected by an unbalanced force.

David likes the number 9 not because it divisible by 3, but, because it can make One turn, and be reduced to the number 1 only by dividing itself. And, since the Spirit is divides by two, good and evil, we have the divide and conquer by division and multiplication. 9/3 =3 That would be the trinity, and it is false doctrine. One turn, it becomes 6. 6/3 = 2, 2/2 1 = 1. The Father and the Sun. An unbalanced force. And, since we see it, it can exist yet not exist. It's still. So, it is not the Name, or the Word. It is not at rest. Only absolute Truth cannot be measured, has no equal or opposite, indivisible, and has the Name above all Names. And, the Word and the are Nameless.


"If you want to swim on the ocean of the bosom of Truth, you must reduce yourself to a zero" Gandhi gets credit, Logos actually delivered the messaged.

Universe - One turn. One turning. One psalm or line of poetry, One song, One verse. We simply have to turn it around, because, you advance from front to back. That is retreating. You must start the back, and advance the front.

'Have you the beginning that you are looking for the end? You see, the beginning is where the end will be"

Light and Darkness, life and death, right and left, are brothers of one another. They are inseparable. Because of this neither are the good good, nor evil evil, nor is life life, nor death death. For this reason each one will dissolve into its original nature. But those who are exalted above the world are indissoluble, eternal.

Names given to worldly things are very deceptive for they divert our thoughts from what is correct to what is incorrect. Thus one who hears the word God, he does not perceive what is correct, but perceives what is incorrect. So also with the Father and the Son and Holy Spirit and life and light and resurrection and the (Ecclesia, assembly not church) and all the rest - people do not perceive what is correct. The names which are heard in the world are meant to deceive. If they were in the Aeon, they would at no time be used as names in the world. Nor were they set among worldly things. They have an end in the Aeon.

The Sun is not eternal, or immortal. It will die out eventually, so, in order to evolve, we must devolve. And, thank your lucky stars that we live in a 'Galaxy', not a universe.

Ask David, how can you 'advance' from being number one? Not, number 2. Nine is a significant number, but, I it applies to a different book. Starts with a Q. And, since there is not good or/and evil, it is all a story of exactly how to merge the posts together, and, then the threads, delete and destroy them, then create a new forum on the internet.:) New heaven on earth. Because, the way books are interpreted as of now, your goal had best to go to hell.....:))) It's funny, but seriously funny.

Does that make sense

And, Truth will never die, and cannot be upset by an unbalanced force, Truth is Truth. Truth has no opposite or equal. Wisdom can 'measure' Truth, but Wisdom can both redeem or destroy those who do not have the Name.

Truth is everywhere, yet nowhere. It exists in everyone, yet no one.

The Tao that can be followed is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the origin of heaven and earth
While, naming is the origin of the myriad things.
Therefore, always desireless, you see the mystery
Ever desiring, you see the manifestations
These two are the same
When they appear they are named differently.
This sameness is the mystery,
Mystery within mystery;
The door to all marvels.[B]

One single name is not uttered in the world, the name which the Father gave to the Son, the name above all things; the name of the Father. For the Son would not become Father unless he wears the name of the Father. Those who have this name know it, but they do not speak it. But those who do not have it do not know it.

But Truth brought names into existence in the world because it is not possible to teach without names. Truth is one single thing and it is also many things for our sakes who learn this one thing in love through many things. The powers wanted to deceive man, since they saw that he had kinship with those that are truly good. They took the name of those that are good and gave it to those who are not good, so that through the names they might deceive him and bind them to those that are not good. And afterward, if they do them a favor, they will be made to remove them from those that are not good and place them among those that are good. These things they knew, for they wanted to take the free man and make him a slave to them forever.

He should have said like a root of a tree, and pulled it up by it's root, and took an axe to it. And, one "tree" will take you around the world in 80 ways.
Test it. Your names define you, and they also will tell you more about yourself than any 'psychic'.

Sorry for the length. But, the message is elementary, it's the logic that complicates it, and, the deception lies in man's 'redefining' the Words. And, I have names that link me to a lot of characters in that seemingly incomprehensible book of craziness. And, I am linked to a lot of 'beasts', believe me, it's a story, and not literal, and is the father of all Siamese twins.

I'll post somethings about numbers and names of mine that you might find amusing. There is no literal 'second coming'. It really is a story of how Truth has to revealed through myth, and it we cannot co-exist, or exist as a divided society. It a coming to Jesus meeting through an event that never actually happened literally. Very little history lies in that book. But, there are a lot of lies. Or, at least it appears that way, because, man put his grubby little fingers on it, and, put the heresy in, and the Wisdom out. So, look for the heretics.

I forgot about 1.7321. Notice that he understands that you have to shrink, not think. He was moving from back to front, but, he subtracted using the powers of ten, not nine, and he arrived at one, but, he is repeating the process. He didn't redeem himself, and when you are playing with numbers, you can arrive at a number of beasts. Because he may have thought he was subtracting, but he may have been playing some algebra here. x =7(3+2+1) x = 42/6 =7 and x is a variable that could = 7 to the tenth power, and that is one 7 horned, 10 headed beast. Or, he simply cubed it. using the power of to arrive at nine, or you want to be become 'whole', you better use whole numbers. Names and numbers are what men use to define the Word. And that is dangerous, especially when you use crooked math.

I could ask What one?: Which of these do you want? Which do you want? Which book do you want? Which one? Go which ever way you please, you'll end up here. At One. And, one to the tenth power still equals one. Any way you play will always lead you back from whence you came. It's only when you stop the game, can you realize the self. Study the Word, because, numbers always mark a beast, trust me. That was my message in my song. But, i turned it around with what man perceives to be the lowest number on the list, and doesn't exist.

peace

steve

Madame Blavatsky really gets a bad rap. There is nothing she says that I have read, that I do not know for a fact, or have disagreed with as being entirely possible. We don't know some things, but, the things she writes that I cannot prove, I have certainly had the same perceptions. The heretics are in, and the Spirit speaks as a beast.

It is all in the Word, it's just not in the book, or interpreted correctly. She is not a deceiver, I can personally guarantee that. And, she is spot on when she says western religion inhibits enlightenment. Read the Gospels that came from the Spirit of Jesus the Nazarene Christ, in the flesh of the Virgin whom the powers defiled. Mary....the Magdalene.

Please explain why you do not have the rights to say more? Is there a limit as it is applies to length? Or, is there a double-standard of what is good for the gooses, but, not for the ganders?

Thanks. I will post something that will demonstrate exactly what she wrote about. Believe me on that one.

I am curious as to what or why you are prohibited from saying.

peace

steve eden

I know I’ll never see the sun, as 1.7321
Such is my reality, a sad irrationality

i'm sorry steveeden

your theosophy is way too deep for me

Me too, which is why I do not have a religion. The religion is love. The worship of Providence needs no organize set of rituals, doctrines, dogma, or buildings.

It must be eradicated, along with the other Truly evils of society. Government, Politics, and the economic beast of Capitalism. One law. Love. One Governor. Yourself. One Court. Your Conscience. One Government of Society. Anarcho-Socialism. Economy. Equal reward for equal work.

We can only do that by eliminating the concept of the 'root', "Capitalize". Gaining an advantage at the expense of others. So, you want to be a slave, to the advantage of a few?

Or, would you like to take advantage of others for your personal gain?

Or, would everyone to participate as 'indenture servants' to one cause, and eventually become a Truly 'separate yet equal' society, and eventually free ourselves?

Restore Chaos to order and form, or, return to the root of your own nature. And, man cannot evolve beyond a 'sub, sub species'. Think about it. Is that really 'evolution'?

The 'script - ures' are not exclusive to religions.

Find the Truth in everything you see, hear, or taste, or smell, or touch. If you cannot, you have found nothing.

Those who have the Name, know it , but do not speak it. Those who do not have it, do not know it.

What is he saying? He's actually quite hilarious.:)

peace

theosophy is not deep. And, you can actually walk on water.
 

No it isn't. Just focus. And, it does involve even more than I wrote.

If you really want. Just google the number 1.7321. If you research the number, as I am going to, I promise you will find a lot of names. The Truth is everywhere now. You simply have to be a little 'googly-eyed':)

See if you can see it this way.

His poem is a reflection of how man is like a car. He thinks he needs to put in drive to move forward. When he actually driving in reverse.

Universe literally means 'one turn, or turning'. Reverse means 'return'. So, if he does not turn it around, he is going to return, and keep returning until he understands, and redeems himself. He's driving alone, so, who can help him?

Or. In the context of the Nazarene. The 'broadway' will take you in circles. The 'narrow way' will take you straight through to the True 'way'. The Milky Way. And "Galaxy" is Greek from the 'root' of one Word. "Milk".


And once you find the Truth, you'll become a heretic. Trust me on that.:)

If you ask me. I can't present many other different ways of how no matter what manner of travel you use, you can't be born of a father. Unless, father is the Mother. And, the Father is the Sun. And, since we have to all be 'conceived though an immaculate conception'. We have to become the One who plants the seed. And, the Virgin gives birth to a new 'man-child'. The
The Father and the Son. New heaven new earth.

I would love to continue, so, see what you see, and ask me to clarify what you do not.

Because, I can say that I am the way, the Truth, and the Life. Without any claims of any 'grandiosity', or, imply that am any sort of 'prophet', or Jesus Jr., any one more special than you or anyone else. and so can you.

Everyone sees prophesy as a 'seed'. They've all seen as it has been 'sown'. Few, however, have seen it as it has been 'reaped'. Anyone who claims to be a prophet, is indeed 'prophesying'. He is a 'sower' of his own seed. One who has reaped, realizes that prophesy is already 'ripe for harvest', and the only thing he can do is 'profit' from it. You can only know prophesy, and when you understand that, you then know that you can create your own 'destiny'. One sows, and another reaps.

History does not exist as nothing more than an illusion. You cannot 'predict' the future. Because, destiny is reality, with guaranteed certainty.

No one can die and rise up to heaven. "What goes up must come down". Gravity. You cannot defy gravity.

The only 'way' to eternal life, is to die and go to hell. And, hell is where all the fun stuff is. Sex, drugs, and rock n roll.:))) And, ecstasy is the best buzz there is, in my opinion. I only took it once, back in the early 80's. And, it was awesome!

Ask me if you would like it addressed another 'way'. The highway is straight and narrow, but, it has several 'lanes'. It's an interstate. And, in America, they all contains 'three numbers'....It's not Route 66, it is more like Interstate 666.

Free will. It has to be turned around. You cannot 'free to be will', you can only 'will to be free'. And, you best become a slave to your will, and then you can choose to become free to be whatever you like. Your wish is my command. So, call me St. Genie.:))))

I cannot post youtube videos yet. So, here are the lyrics to a song you might have heard. Let me know if you know it, and play it. It's a message.

Please allow me to introduce myself
I'm a man of wealth and taste
I've been around for a long long year stolen many a man's soul and faith
I was around Jesus Christ had his moment of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that Pilate washed his hands and sealed his fate
Pleased to meet you hope you guess my name
But what's puzzling you is the nature of my game

Stuck around St. Petersburg when I saw it was a time for a change
Killed the Czar and his ministers; Anastasia screamed in vain
I rode a tank held a generals rank when the blitzkrieg
raged and the bodies stank
Pleased to meet you hope your guess my name, oh yeah
Ah what's puzzling you is the nature of my game, oh yeah

I watched the glee while your kings and queens fought for
ten decades for the Gods they made
I shouted out "who killed the Kennedy's?" when after all it was you and me
Let me please introduce myself I'm a man of wealth and taste
And I lay traps for troubadours who get killed before they reach Bombay

Pleased to meet you hope you guess my name, oh yeah
But what's puzzling you is the nature of my game, oh yeah

Pleased to meet you hope you guess my name
But what's confusing you is just the nature of my game

Just as every cop is a criminal
And all the sinners saints
As heads is tails
Just call me Lucifer
'Cause I'm in need of some restraint

So if you meet me Have some courtesy
Have some sympathy, and some taste
Use all your well-learned politesse
Or I'll lay your soul to waste, um yeah

Pleased to meet you
Hope you guessed my name, um yeah
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game, um mean it, get down

Woo, who
Oh yeah, get on down
Oh yeah
Oh yeah!

Tell me baby, what's my name
Tell me honey, can ya guess my name
Tell me baby, what's my name
I tell you one time, you're to blame

oh, who
woo, woo
Woo, who
Woo, woo
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Oh, yeah

What's my name
Tell me, baby, what's my name
Tell me, sweetie, what's my name

Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Woo, who, who
Oh, yeah
Woo woo
Woo woo

peace

steve

I have read some of the "major religious texts," and a scattering of other such polemics by gurus, theologists, and other assorted observers of "reality."

For my money, many seem to point to a state of consciousness that includes serenity, which I find attractive, and attainable through some types of meditation.

I believe many of these ancient texts were sort of trail head markers, and most give us permission to make it up as we go along (as they were doing), before the jailer mentality of each institution began interpreting and translating in ways that protected a power base for and of the particular institution that grew up in the wake with the person who had the vision of reality that appealed to them.

Symbolic language can transcend time and speak across cultures to universal human experiences. However much of this is lost in authoritative editing.

It takes a certain amount of time on the planet grappling with the stuff of life to develop a sense of what these ancient texts are really trying to show us a way to.


I liken it to a popular kiddie ride at our local Boardwalk:

The most educational ride is a little round low tub of water with a few plastic boats: for the little tykes.

Each has a couple of steering wheels (for the married couples I'm guessing?), but the steering wheels are not actually connected to anything.

'Round and 'round they go, "steering" their destinies.

Buy the time the kids reach age 5 or 6 they figure out that the steering wheels aren't actually connected to anything and don't have anything to do with navigating their course, so they then move on to more interesting rides.

I was 58!

Oh sure, there's a red plastic "horn" in the center of the steering wheel you can pound on to make that pathetic "squeak." But that's just the complaint dept. It doesn't help either.

RE: How many people here have read the major religious texts of the major religions?
 

Somebody here gets it:)

Do you see something between The Book of Tao, and, the so-called heresies?

The Name Jesus the Nazarene Christ was not the problem. Logos is everywhere as everyone. It's what they do with Names.

So, He taught eastern, they Just turn Him Country and Western. Johnny Cash, the man in black:) But, if people do see themselves as everyone, they will never understand what He had to portray. Read the heretics like Thomas, Phillip and Mary's fragmented bits, and then here's a link to something I think you find interesting.

Home

As for meditation, you have stimulate the energy of what you know as kundalini. She sits in cave of the sacrum. That's where she lies. You are apparently capable of True enlightenment. I see it in your Words. And, I can feel auras, I've been able since I was young. I knew from childhood, that probably the only man standing. So, you all saved me, trust me.

I enjoy when i see someone who actually sees from the inside.

But, for the sake of the people who glasses on, this isn't about any personal salvation. It's done, It has been, we are the world, and it is one.

Freebie from the 'Dialogue of the Savior' I'm the last man standing.

"Nothing, then, redeems us from this world. But the All which we are, we are saved. We have received salvation from end to end. Let us think in this way! Let us comprehend in this way!" - Dialogue of the Savior

I did not actually awakened. I was made to awaken. To present the dialogue

peace

i have read several versions of the Tao Te Qin - i find it most applicable to martial arts philosophy, really, than a "general" worldview, but i think Bruce Lee was there before me

the only "heresies" here are the so-called Taoists later perverted the TTQ into a lot of mystical goobledy**** and imported Indian deities and created talismen and what not and so on and so forth, consecrating entirely the original message of Lao Tze

It is possible to experience Being -directly- without our cultural bias despoiling it with interpretive verbal "words" describing and therefore defining, the experience.

What is, is.

With or without our definitions, and can be experienced as such directly, with or without interpretation.

In fact this one word of truth: Logos: is not generally apprehended by those who traffic in delusive fantasies for the so-called (altruistic) "benefit" of others.


EDIT: And yes, I would be considered by many to be a heretic, but I find myself in good company at least.

How do you get clothes so clean Mr. Lee? Ancient Chinese Secret.:)

I just stick to the 81 little secrets in the interpretation I see as most accurate.

All in the world recognize the beautiful as beautiful.
Herein lies ugliness.
All recognize the good as good.
Herein lies evil.
Therefore
Being and non-being produce each other.
Difficulty and ease bring about each other.
Long and short delimit each other.
High and low rest on each other.
Sound and voice harmonize each other.
Front and back follow each other.
Therefore the sage abides in the condition of wu-wei (unattached action).
And carries out the wordless teaching.
Here, the myriad things are made, yet not separated.
Therefore the sage produces without possessing,
Acts without expectations
And accomplishes without abiding in her accomplishments.
It is precisely because she does not abide in them
That they never leave her.

And, I know the Word, but, I never said it. And, I am certainly unattached from it.
And abide rhymes with pride.
Let the loud be proud
And the ego, should be eggo, and let go
Id rhymes with squid
Ego that is super, think stupor.

Freud needed some psych something. He was mental. He crossed over that fine line I believe

Nietzsche however, was one pretty enlightened 'sophist'. whoops. I let the cat out of the bag. Wink.

How do you 'study' something that you only use about 5% of at most.

I think I overestimated, probably about 5 percent. Give or take.:)

peace




peace

To be in harmony with the Universe is serenity, AKA "The Kingdom of God is within you."

"...How do you 'study' something that you only use about 5% of at most..."

The part of the iceburg that is visible in the sunlight is the product of the larger portion that resides out of sight, under the surface.

The main portion of the unseen iceburg I would call the subconscious, and though it appears inert our subconscious is actually always churning and maintaining its internal connections to support our "reality" (the portion we are "aware" of, above the surface): what we call our conscious thought (usually grappling with our "committee," as evidence of this constant churning below).

To be in the "present" moment is to -I believe- access the brain's right hemisphere, while letting the churning of the left brain fall asleep: meditation.

It is then that we experience the present moment FREE from past associations verbally, culturally, and dualistically. We experience non-duality and a temporary suspension of the tyranny of left brain dominance, with its concommitant verbalizations, justifications, and drama: these concerns fall from central focus as mattering anymore (temporarily).

It is THEN we apprehend the Taoist thought in the quoted verses, and the symbolic language that points to this "other" reality as evidenced in all ancient texts (if you have the ears to hear it).

It is also then that I know in what frame of mind St. Francis of Assissi was in when he grokked what he later wrote down as The Prayer of St Francis:

"...Lord, make me an instrument of your peace.
Where there is hatred, let me sow love.
Where there is injury, pardon.
Where there is doubt, faith.
Where there is despair, hope.
Where there is darkness, light.
Where there is sadness, joy.
O Divine Master,
grant that I may not so much seek to be consoled, as to console;
to be understood, as to understand;
to be loved, as to love.
For it is in giving that we receive.
It is in pardoning that we are pardoned,
and it is in dying that we are born to Eternal Life.
Amen."

RE: This is long and I did not want to get into this. Read and forget everything.
 

I see two things here. The first part about the iceburg, and the message you get is absolutely insightful and represents absolute insight into the aspects of what the Tao and all the teachings are meant to teach us. We do not see things from the outside in. We see from the inside out, and, that is the problem. We have look within, that is the message.

The 'image' and the 'counterfeit'. The illusion. The iceburg is perceived by the eyes to be above the surface, when it is actually product, or image of something from below the surface that we see.

But, the second part totally contradicts the Tao. This is religion as it defined. If we too see things inside that book, we have it understand in the same concept. We are looking at what as the iceburg on the surface. The iceburg is a perfect of how must turn it inside out. If want to see the Truth, then we have see what was not included in the book.

The New Testament contains one-third of the teachings of Jesus the Nazarene Christ...."a third of the waters will be made wormwood"

wormwood is vermouth.....brandy.

"just as Moses lifted the serpent in the wilderness, so too must Son of man be lifted"

Moses ran from the serpent first, but, then the LORD told him to pick the serpent up “from the tail”. This is the one of two things to be taken from the Moses simile.

The Son of man must be lifted up “by the tail”, or at the “end”. Man has Jesus being lifted up at the “beginning”, or by his “head”.

You have to look outside, before, ever stepping inside that book. And, St. Francis was demonstrating the exact opposite message.

He speaking also of the 'tail' which is symbolic for the beginning process of kundalini. It is the force located in the sacrum. The Holy Spirit if you will. Every religion has a name. It's Logos, 'something like the Son of man'. The Spirit of the Mother



We don't want it to get out. It would ruin the deception, and I am the deceiver. ......If we cannot see the Truth in nature. Then, Logos gave us plenty of other ways. One Word. You want to know the real beast is. The king of rock n roll. Elvis! Tell me he did not 'sell his soul for rock n roll'!:)

It is just a story, among a million other stories, and we kind of just have to use it for some evidence. Not a religion to create our own images, and then bow to our little creations. The Old Testament just demonstrates how the prophecies in the New Testament were fulfilled in every story.

Who didn't die in that book? Eve. Enoch....God 'took' him. Elijah....went up in a whirlwind? But, Samuel....he went down to Sheol. Samuel means 'the name of god' Sammy Davis Jr. Son of Sam. David Burkowitz. So, did the Jews kill the Son of god? A bunch.:) :stupid:

Starting with Gen 2. Not one.

That would be our own little "Kingdom of heaven and earth". The Kingdom of the 'Voice, Mind, Spirit, Principle, invoked to call and pour and funnel 'libations'. Shhhhh. If you build it, they will come.

If you do not believe this, try it yourself.

Elvis the king of rock n roll – L. the virgin who became the bitter whore.

My Mother's Name means literally 'Magdalene towering bright light, the L. of Eden' The day star that must arise in all hearts. Read the books that Mary wrote. 'Mary had a little lamb, little lamb, little lamb' Three Marys. If you get clue, you'll be partially awake, but, still asleep.

Here's the really good news that must be preached to all nations.

"Nothing, then, redeems us from this world. But the All which we are, we are saved. We have received salvation from end to end. Let us think in this way! Let us comprehend in this way!" - Dialogue of the Savior

If everyone would look at that from end to end?

Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is." - Gospel of Thomas

How can the end be where the beginning 'is'?

Unless we are dinosaurs, we want to consider shrinking a bit.

Hey you, expecting results without effort! So sensitive! So long-suffering! You, in the clutches of death, acting like an immortal! Hey sufferer, you are destroying yourself!
-Santideva, Bodhicaryavatara

"I love you when you bow in your mosque, kneel in your temple, pray in your church. For you and I are sons of one religion, and it is the spirit." Kahlil Gibran

There not that is a nice guy. I can't seem that point across, so, I blasted from all sides.:)


We just have to try to do something but sit our butts and argue. I don't think it's going to happen. But, it only had to happen to one person. We are the world. So, I really think its about not coming back in a universe.

We see "In through the out door".....Who said Led Zeppelin sold out? 1980...The Wall.

And, Dec 8, 1980. The day the earth stood still. If you remember, everyone stopped when John Lennon was shot. Mark David Chapman. There might be a whole story there as well.

John was a martyr. And preachers say it was god's wrath for saying the Beatles were more famous than Jesus:)

I believe they were both, and another example of how many times we were shown how much more than a crucifixion a servant suffers. There will be shock for pulpit puking, pocket picking, thousand suit wearing men of God.

And, I have some things were not acceptable behavior according dogma, but, I swear I have never fondled and had relations with little boys. I met my wife at the family reunion, and I am sticking with her, even though she started screwing her hairstylist, and let's just it was meant to be. I was to be alone. And, I refused to listen when was I had to give up for the cause.
So, it was for me. sad story.:offtopic:


And, Elvis did not write one single song, and he is the king of rock n roll? Even the king isn't the Boss.

A couple different books with the same message. Look back to front, I will show you.

"Say, Allah will grant faith to whom We will, and by that, You will be justified. Allah provides faith to whom We choose, and by that, We therefore justify whom We choose. Allah provides belief to the non-believers, and non-believe to those who may believe, and by that, We therefore justify whom We please. Surely there is a sign for those who reflect.

Surely there is a sign for those who "re-flect" I assume you know what 'reflection' means. I hope I don't need to break that down:)

Reflect who those for sign "a" is there surely. Please We whom justify therefore We that by and believe may who those to believe non the belief to provides the Halla. Choose We whom justify therefore We that by and choose We to faith provides Halla. Justified be will You that by and will we whom to grant faith will Halla say.

Does reading back to front sound like a curse and blessing, or just a blessing?

We have to see a palindrome. So, since the H was one H, and we H an H. We either drop one, or add one. So, now is the choice. HallaH, or AllA

Hallah - loaf of bread.

this is the 'origin'. Someone added a 'c' to the Word, so when you research it, it is Challah. okay. They added a 'c' so put in front. Nope. They also have another spelling. Challeh. so Hallah, becomes Challah, then Challeh.

It's makes your head spin now. But, it is Hebrew, yet Judaism. It's a Jewish day now, not a Hebrew day. Do, you see a problem. Read it. You have to read both ways, because, both Hebrew and Arabic are written right to left, and not left to right, and Arabic in 'cursive'. The alphabets are really interesting, but, you don't want that burden.

Challah now becomes.

a loaf of rich white bread leavened with yeast and containing eggs, often braided before baking, prepared especially for the Jewish sabbath.

They added the rising agent. And, they fell. Now, you don't history repeats. Over and over and over.

Read it and then backward assuming sabbath to mean 'a day of rest'. Now, you are stuck. Because, you have to research. Because, it was just slightly altered. Sabbat. And, it gets to Shabbath, and Sabbath.

Confused? If you're not, I'm not showing you right. You don't just dunk in a water and come a bible scholar. It's just doesn't happen. These books are messages for man to try make to some sense out of nonsense. And, he created myths from the messages meant to ease his uncertainty.

That's why it's everywhere and not seen. You answered the question with the iceberg allegory. It's not an allegory. So Sabbat. Logos tries to teach.
Sabbath is Sabbat, not Sabbath.

(in the 14th–16th centuries) a secret rendezvous of witches and sorcerers for worshiping the Devil, characterized by orgiastic rites, dances, feasting, etc.

It's a special application of the Sabbath. And, it was fr. for 'witches day'

But, be thankful for English. another word for Sabbath

Now, you go to Sabbath, and the bottom says 'synonym, see Sunday'.

So, you can see why we can't see.

Go back to the bottom line. We are all seeing an illusion, because, we choose not to follow simple laws applicable to nature, and move forward from the back to front.

From left to right goes east.

East to West goes left.

North to South goes down.

And how any area Middle East, Far East, NW SW NE SW.

And NeWark is exactly on NW parallel 40 degrees. 1107 Empire Drive

Here the real meaning.

It just a story I hope.:) I know the answer. I can prove I know the Way.
I can prove I can help. But, help what? Only, Logos, the Word can Truly set you free. Not me. I am only because I am not. A symbol. A guide to the directions. It's then your time to make yourselves shine. This is not my duty. It is because I care, not because I have to.

It is not rocket science. So, I figured that the only to ever try to help, is through the only Truth that isn't altered. Prose and music. Lyrics, poems, fictional stories. Stories are declared to be fiction, mythology. Fantasy.

That is the only Way through the Truth. We are being made well aware that we are devolving not evolving.

sorry it's long, and probably a bunch of mistakes, but I see half of your point is clearly accurate.

So the question is obvious to everyone.

How do you know what you look like?

We have turn names. And, to turn Words. Simple. Not at all simple. I've done it. It's hard. I'm just trying to make it easier, and, every seems to think I am confusing. Then, just take Route Confucius.

It's about morality and not insanity.

And, you my connections through names, you would not want this baggage, that is the Truth. You would know what a suffering servant really means.

I just wanted to demonstrate just a minuscule of the effort it takes to learn the Truth. And, was indeed shown and enlightened by something. And, I know it was cosmic.

And, I wasn't a 'chosen' person, I was more 'thrusted". Because, when they Jesus went in the wilderness, and was 'tempted'......uh uh.....I was driven in circles for five hours with my head just badgering about everything I didn't know. And, I was clearly informed that this 'entity' Satan did not exist. He exists in the mind, if you create him, and is as strong a force as you allow it to become.

I'll bet that the little sperm worm that brought itself into being. So, you are born of a woman, or a man. One is an eggshooter. The other simply carries the egg. The billions of eggshots evidently that odds so they increased the chances. Lottery sperm game. There is bound to a winner.

I hope I am not the only one humoring myself, because, my goal is to at one place a happy place where everybody gets along and converts through music and prose, and then some of you out there probably have some talent. We'll write a song, and sell it to some obscure and land it #467 on the charts, or youtube with 140 views :beer:

But, it wasn't a burning bush, that was 1 or so prior was awakened, and shown where we were. But, I was also shown the better part of this heaven and the earth beneath.

Post some music. Please? I wanna rock.

So ask questions or your insight into what you believe, and no my god is better stuff. I didn't to debate religion, we have us the Words of the subjects of idolatry and adulation......I may cheesy, I am preachy

I have a feeling however.



peace

thx for answer, nice post.
first i want to say is that when i started reading and understanding theosophic culture and literature i did it not for to do some critics but understand it and to get deeper in it. Blavatsky was one of the last theosophists i have red and in process of reading i was checking everything, one of her books took me about a year and half to read. There was need of knowing of pradhivedanta svami prabhupada, bible, qabbalah, voyage des pelerins buddhistes, sourse of measures, thora and many other (which i cant translate from russian) and i totally believe her, at last what she writes.

the rights, they are about limits, there are some things that you can share and some things you can not, but its not a secret or something like that, its the matter of discussion.

sorry for my english, im georgian and have less experience using the language.

No problem. If you would like, check into the prophesies of Anna Kingsford. She is very interesting, and was also enlightened. As for so-called 'philosophers', Nietzsche might be one you would also check out. And, as 'Freddies' go, Mercury was awesome:)

peace

Heck, I've even read a lot of minor religious texts from minor religions like the Yezidi and Ilmu Khodam

i tried Nietzsche couple years ago, i can't say anything bad about his works but i kinda dont like them, and thx for advise ill check Anna Kingsford's works also:)