America going broke, I say flat tax

Gregor XIII · 04-29-2011, 08:28 PM

And how many transfer numbers does that amount to in a year? And how many resources does the government have to check it? And how much are the Government even allowed to check on these without consent or suspicion?

Though, admittedly, I'm not American. You might have some very weird laws on privacy. But it's such an enourmus amount of information, and I didn't think that you were allowed to just make random searches on it, and then, I can easily see how people can not notice.

Burning Down · 04-29-2011, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor XIII

And how many transfer numbers does that amount to in a year? And how many resources does the government have to check it? And how much are the Government even allowed to check on these without consent or suspicion?

Though, admittedly, I'm not American. You might have some very weird laws on privacy. But it's such an enourmus amount of information, and I didn't think that you were allowed to just make random searches on it, and then, I can easily see how people can not notice.

Well, I guess as long as the transactions are kept secret, nobody will find out, right?

And I'm not American either, so I don't have a clear idea of US privacy laws.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 04-29-2011, 11:49 PM

Well, many smaller amounts of money can be transferred from many sources.

hip hop bunny hop · 04-30-2011, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Well, I guess as long as the transactions are kept secret, nobody will find out, right?

Oh facepalm.

Quote:

Well, many smaller amounts of money can be transferred from many sources.

You know what? Let's put that questionable logic aside.

Ok, you've managed to succesfully transfer funds from Europe to the USA with no one being onto you. What then? You won't be able to invest the money; and, obviously, this applies to more than the stock market and bonds and what have you. No real estate. Anything that'd require substantial insurance is out of the question. So, congrats - you can't grow your money. (Y)

Further, since 9/11 the USA hsa "convinced" other nations (yes, including Switzerland) to disclose sketchy account activity. So, you'd have to duck not only domestic agencies, but international organizations and agencies of the nation you're drawing the fund from.

I mean, FFS... you do realize the most commonly held bachelor degree held by FBI agents is accounting, right?

Urban Hat€monger ? · 04-30-2011, 02:07 AM

Judging by the comments here I don't think people really understand how offshore tax havens work so allow me to explain as simply as I can.

Let's say you own a business in the U.S.
Now let's assume one year you make a nice profit on that business, you have to pay tax to the U.S. government on that profit, there's no getting away from that so you do so.

So now you have your perfectly legal taxed profit. So what you do is what any sensible business man does, you put it in the bank to gain interest.
Problem is if you do this in an American based bank you're going to get stung for tax again on the interest those profits generate. So you simply register a company on an offshore tax haven such as the Channel Islands, Cayman Islands, Bermuda or Liechtenstein. There you can leave your profits generate high levels of interest and because the money has nothing to do with the U.S. government they can't touch it.
You can also stick your companies assets in there too and then they become exempt from tax too.

And then finally you can choose to re-locate there and then that means you can transfer your companies profits to your own bank account and avoid the government getting their hands on that in income tax as well.

So basically you don't need secret bank accounts or smuggled gold bars because you can avoid paying 2 lots of tax perfectly legally.

Of course it's much more complex than that but that's the basic set up.

Dotoar · 04-30-2011, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skaligojurah

I mean, after all, if Bill Gates wanted to, he could probably send every citizen in America a thousand dollar check in the mail. Problem is, the sneaky ****s at the top know how to cheat the system. In fact, that's why our economy crashed in the first place.

Yeah, that sneaky bastard Gates has only donated a few billion bucks so far.

Dotoar · 04-30-2011, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down

That, and also the fact that American banks are not regulated by the government, so they can do whatever the hell they want when it comes to mortgage rates and investments. Also, the Federal Reserve is separate from the government, almost like a third-party actor, and it doesn't help that interest rates are determined by a non-governmental institution.

As Janszoon pointed out, that's simply not true. Well, the banks themselves may be private, but the banking system in which they work is heavily regulated, which is why we're facing such a vast financial crisis.

Chumley · 04-30-2011, 05:47 AM

The US needs Donald Trump to take charge and tell the Chinese who's boss. Let OPEC know that we the west are not going to pay thier prices. Get the US out of debt. Like he says, "everybody knows I'm a smart guy and I have a great, great company."

Like Obama said, " a sideshow and a carnival barker." Trump has gone into bankruptcy four times and has ripped off thousands investors and this guy is leading in the GOP polls.

This man is dangerous, delusional, and a criminal.

Can he really be serious about running for the president of the US?

djchameleon · 04-30-2011, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Hatemonger

Judging by the comments here I don't think people really understand how offshore tax havens work so allow me to explain as simply as I can.

Let's say you own a business in the U.S.
Now let's assume one year you make a nice profit on that business, you have to pay tax to the U.S. government on that profit, there's no getting away from that so you do so.

So now you have your perfectly legal taxed profit. So what you do is what any sensible business man does, you put it in the bank to gain interest.
Problem is if you do this in an American based bank you're going to get stung for tax again on the interest those profits generate. So you simply register a company on an offshore tax haven such as the Channel Islands, Cayman Islands, Bermuda or Liechtenstein. There you can leave your profits generate high levels of interest and because the money has nothing to do with the U.S. government they can't touch it.
You can also stick your companies assets in there too and then they become exempt from tax too.

And then finally you can choose to re-locate there and then that means you can transfer your companies profits to your own bank account and avoid the government getting their hands on that in income tax as well.

So basically you don't need secret bank accounts or smuggled gold bars because you can avoid paying 2 lots of tax perfectly legally.

Of course it's much more complex than that but that's the basic set up.

Thank you for this. I was going to post something similar to this after reading the first two pages.

Another thing that I would like to clear up that people have a misconception about.

Income earned from the stock market is NOT untaxed. Sure, it's not fully taxed like regular income but it is still partly taxed. The two taxes that you don't have to pay on income earned through the stock market is social security and medicare tax. You have to pay the other two taxes though.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 04-30-2011, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dotoar

Yeah, that sneaky bastard Gates has only donated a few billion bucks so far.

It's not a knock on Bill Gates. Only trying to illustrate the massive gap between top, and bottom.

As for the annonymous accounts, I do believe they exist. I do believe there is a concept of hiding money away undetected. Anybody who doesn't is naive. I mean, drug lords have to keep their money somewhere.

Besides, even for the open tax evasion, it shows how powerless our ultra-right wing system is to tycoons, really.

04-29-2011, 08:28 PM	#21 (permalink)
Gregor XIII Music Addict Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: San Diego Posts: 57	And how many transfer numbers does that amount to in a year? And how many resources does the government have to check it? And how much are the Government even allowed to check on these without consent or suspicion? Though, admittedly, I'm not American. You might have some very weird laws on privacy. But it's such an enourmus amount of information, and I didn't think that you were allowed to just make random searches on it, and then, I can easily see how people can not notice. __________________ Agnes Varda's Le Bonheur + thoughts on women in Akhmatova and Mizuguchi: The Centrifugue

04-30-2011, 02:07 AM	#25 (permalink)
Urban Hat€monger ? The Sexual Intellectual Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere cooler than you Posts: 18,605	Judging by the comments here I don't think people really understand how offshore tax havens work so allow me to explain as simply as I can. Let's say you own a business in the U.S. Now let's assume one year you make a nice profit on that business, you have to pay tax to the U.S. government on that profit, there's no getting away from that so you do so. So now you have your perfectly legal taxed profit. So what you do is what any sensible business man does, you put it in the bank to gain interest. Problem is if you do this in an American based bank you're going to get stung for tax again on the interest those profits generate. So you simply register a company on an offshore tax haven such as the Channel Islands, Cayman Islands, Bermuda or Liechtenstein. There you can leave your profits generate high levels of interest and because the money has nothing to do with the U.S. government they can't touch it. You can also stick your companies assets in there too and then they become exempt from tax too. And then finally you can choose to re-locate there and then that means you can transfer your companies profits to your own bank account and avoid the government getting their hands on that in income tax as well. So basically you don't need secret bank accounts or smuggled gold bars because you can avoid paying 2 lots of tax perfectly legally. Of course it's much more complex than that but that's the basic set up. __________________ Urb's RYM Stuff Most people sell their soul to the devil, but the devil sells his soul to Nick Cave.

04-30-2011, 05:47 AM	#28 (permalink)
Chumley Music Addict Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 69	The US needs Donald Trump to take charge and tell the Chinese who's boss. Let OPEC know that we the west are not going to pay thier prices. Get the US out of debt. Like he says, "everybody knows I'm a smart guy and I have a great, great company." Like Obama said, " a sideshow and a carnival barker." Trump has gone into bankruptcy four times and has ripped off thousands investors and this guy is leading in the GOP polls. This man is dangerous, delusional, and a criminal. Can he really be serious about running for the president of the US?