Originally Posted by djchameleon (Post 1025616)

I also don't like the fact that it was mainly Catholics that helped to translate the Bible. I have major issues with Catholics but I will get into that another time.

Originally Posted by crukster (Post 1025606)

The thing about the Turkish culture is because of the geographical location, Turkey and in particular Istanbul has always been a melting pot of cultures. Slavic, Romanic, Jewish, Christian, Greek, Turk etc. there's always been all sorts of people living there so the music has influences from all of these places; that is something that distinguishes it from say Iraq or Afghanistan. It's the Bridge between the East and West.

But speaking from a strictly religious viewpoint even, the Book of Dede Korkut is a Turkic folklore passed around all the old Turk states; Kyrghzstan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Azerbaijain etc. and it's from the first days of when the old nomads adopted Islam; it's all these stories about this old man who'd walk around with a Saz singing stories.

http://www.pick-uptheworld.com/images/saz.jpg

http://wiki-images.enotes.com/thumb/...00px-DQNAJ.JPG

This is a statue of the dude


And for 1000 years maybe, there have been wandering poets called "asiks" (ah-shooks) who would sing about all sorts; God, Work, lost Loves etc. I know Iran have something similar to that.


This is all very real, and very Islamic. There is this tendency to limit Islam to the middle eastern countries. But there are Islamic countries worldwide, Turkey, Malaysia like Il Duce said, even the Uighur state that went Rogue from China recently, many more

And all these countries are operating well within the bounds of Islam - arguably some of them contributed many of the things that are traditional to Islam. When a country is in a dire situation they cling to old traditions, which is arguably why the middle east is so fundamentalist. The West bombs the **** out of it, rapes the land and then asks why they're fundamentalist - cos you ****ed their home land up the arse and the religion is all they have left, thats ****in why derp!! And it bothers me that the World sees the entirety of Islam as fundamentalist and anti-proggressive. When in fact Islam is based on the very ideas of tolerance and progression. Compare it to what the Turks where doing before that - cutting your thriat and drinking it, raping and pillaging villages, wearing wolf skins and engaging in depraved rituals. That's fun and all, dont get me wrong I'd have a blast doing that. But when you look at the bigger picture, Islam has brought Humanity and our understanding of the Universe a long way.

As have Judaism and Christianity.

As have Buddhism, Hinduism.

As have most all religions that teach some decent Universal laws for people to live by.

Originally Posted by djchameleon (Post 1025616)

Do Atheists consider themselves a religion? that just seems like an oxymoron to me.

Originally Posted by Schranz bass (Post 1025638)

So, am I to understand from this that you don't have your own ideology? or morals? or purpose? and that Judaism provides the nonsensical, reward-punishment way of life for you to follow so that you can think less?

Originally Posted by crukster (Post 1025655)

In my experience a lot of atheists tend to be pretty evasive about that. The ones I've talked to online (which maybe don't represent the core of atheism and are probably just angry 12 year olds) tend to go by the rule of, while they're telling you how bad religion is, atheism is not a religion or group of any sort, it's just the name "given to them" like infidel or heathen.

But outside of the discussion/in another discussion, those same people argue atheism deserves as much respect as any religion because the choice of "non-belief" (in what tends to be specifically the Abrahamic Faiths) is in itself, apparently a belief and a group. It's hypocrisy.

I think it's stupid. If you truly don't believe in any religion, then there is no relevant word or group you're a part of, religiously speaking. Where you'd write "place your religion here" you'd leave a blank space surely.

That's why generally speaking I don't like atheism, don't respect it. If someone choose not to believe in a religion, or for that matter ANY religion, or God at all, then fine I respect that that's their choice.

But not atheism - atheism to me, equals anti-belief, and nothing in it's own right. I think atheism is arguably the way of the anti-christ, the false messiah, the serpent.

It's completely different from not-believing. People have crisis of faith, people choose not to believe, thats up to them, its not anti- anything it's just the way they go.

But to devote yourself to being ANTI- anything, well then, you cant go and ask for respect from those people. And thats what atheism is imo - anti-religion.




lmao how did you get that from what geddybass said? Do you think people just pull morals and belief and purpose out of their arse? Unless you've been alive for 10,000 years you can't in any way present a personal moral structure that could rival that which the Abrahamic faiths are built on.

I don't want to speak for her, I'm sure she'll answer you, but personally speaking, my religion is the foundation for my morals and purpose. I build on it, adapt it as I see fit and try utmost to do what I believe is right, and live my life like that. I'm sure that's what a lot of people do, maybe I'm flawed in my execution but if so I'll learn from it. That hardly equates to thinking less.






Lepanto wut? Try 29 May 1453 Istanbul when we pulled our ships over the hills with the chains and ****ed the Romans out of our land. Try Gallipoli 1916 when we defended the border against the United forces of the entire western "civilization". The Ottoman Empire was alive and well until the end of WWI. You think one defeat is anything against the entire campaign and History of the Turks? Turks are still alive and strong. If all the Turkic states formed a Union, as is likely will happen, they'll be a World superpower. USA know that, that's why they're scared.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...cLanguages.png

All of those in both shades of blue there. Imo that'll be one of the sides in the next World War.

You can't keep a Turk down. So he loses a battle, well he wins the ****ing war, my friend.

Your mummy who? Dinosaurs wtf?

Are you ****in retarded man, you wanna outright racially insult me, my Blood Homeland, my People? No we do not believe people lived with dinosaurs. Gtfo you ignorant dikhead.

Man you're jealous cos I know my roots. Go learn your own, that's all I can say.

Originally Posted by djchameleon (Post 1025616)

I have a question

Do Atheists consider themselves a religion? that just seems like an oxymoron to me.

Originally Posted by crukster (Post 1025655)

In my experience a lot of atheists tend to be pretty evasive about that. The ones I've talked to online (which maybe don't represent the core of atheism and are probably just angry 12 year olds) tend to go by the rule of, while they're telling you how bad religion is, atheism is not a religion or group of any sort, it's just the name "given to them" like infidel or heathen.

But outside of the discussion/in another discussion, those same people argue atheism deserves as much respect as any religion because the choice of "non-belief" (in what tends to be specifically the Abrahamic Faiths) is in itself, apparently a belief and a group. It's hypocrisy.

I think it's stupid. If you truly don't believe in any religion, then there is no relevant word or group you're a part of, religiously speaking. Where you'd write "place your religion here" you'd leave a blank space surely.

That's why generally speaking I don't like atheism, don't respect it. If someone choose not to believe in a religion, or for that matter ANY religion, or God at all, then fine I respect that that's their choice.

But not atheism - atheism to me, equals anti-belief, and nothing in it's own right. I think atheism is arguably the way of the anti-christ, the false messiah, the serpent.

It's completely different from not-believing. People have crisis of faith, people choose not to believe, thats up to them, its not anti- anything it's just the way they go.

But to devote yourself to being ANTI- anything, well then, you cant go and ask for respect from those people. And thats what atheism is imo - anti-religion.

Originally Posted by Burning Down (Post 1025647)

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this. PM if you don't think posting them in here is a good idea. Or you don't have to tell me anything, I was just curious. My dad was raised in the Roman Catholic Church, and has always said he didn't hesitate to push it out of his life, and he did so when he married my mother. I get the feeling that people today are leaving Catholicism in droves and I have some theories on why that may be, but I love to hear what other people have to say about this.

Originally Posted by Janszoon (Post 1025677)

No, we don't. Why would we?

Originally Posted by djchameleon (Post 1025680)

What is the purpose of your churches then? I'm curious

Originally Posted by Jack Pat (Post 1025681)

Churches? :rofl:

Originally Posted by djchameleon (Post 1025680)

Yeah, I was talking to a friend of mines last night and she said they are technically considered a religion.

I understand why she says they are technically a religion because the definition of religion states a group of people that share the same ideas/ideology. Which is true, they all believe in the non-existence of deities but it just seems like such an oxymoron to have an Atheist Church.

She said there are Atheist churches that exist. I'm like wtf. What do they even talk about there?