Got Feminism?

The Batlord · 08-31-2013, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trollheart

But now it's gone the other way. It's the radical, almost fanatical and angry feminism I can't stand. As has been said here already, things like holding doors, standing up when a woman comes into the room (oh nobody does that anymore do they?), giving up your seat or pushing hers in, offering to pay for the whole date (or just assuming you are), even goddamn smiling at a woman can now get you the label of being a sexist. And why? Are feminists so insecure now that they have to put down men at every opportunity, to show how liberated they are?

Well, giving up your seat to a woman but not to a man is sexist. It's harks back to a time when women were considered the weaker sex. Standing up when a woman comes into the room? That's just pointless. And paying for the whole date is bull****. The woman presumably has a job and her own money. I'm not an ATM and she's not a prostitute. Probably.

~~Lord Larehip~~ · 08-31-2013, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Well, giving up your seat to a woman but not to a man is sexist. It's harks back to a time when women were considered the weaker sex. Standing up when a woman comes into the room? That's just pointless. And paying for the whole date is bull****. The woman presumably has a job and her own money. I'm not an ATM and she's not a prostitute. Probably.

I give up my seat to a woman--just how it is. I hold doors open for anyone, it's just a common courtesy. I don't stand up when a woman comes into the room--if she's hot, I usually can't anyway. Paying for the date is a good sign you might get some before the night is out. If she insists on paying her own way, you ain't getting s-hit.

The Batlord · 08-31-2013, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Larehip

I give up my seat to a woman--just how it is. I hold doors open for anyone, it's just a common courtesy. I don't stand up when a woman comes into the room--if she's hot, I usually can't anyway. Paying for the date is a good sign you might get some before the night is out. If she insists on paying her own way, you ain't getting s-hit.

Why would you give up your seat to a woman but not a man? That's not common courtesy, that's pointless cultural conditioning. Holding the door open for people however makes perfect sense.

Trollheart · 08-31-2013, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

Well, giving up your seat to a woman but not to a man is sexist. It's harks back to a time when women were considered the weaker sex. Standing up when a woman comes into the room? That's just pointless. And paying for the whole date is bull****. The woman presumably has a job and her own money. I'm not an ATM and she's not a prostitute. Probably.

Yeah well as Lord Larehip says, it's just how I was brought up. In this society, whether you like it or not, giving up your seat to a woman will be generally perceived as okay, even laudable, whereas you try giving your seat to a guy unless he's on crutches and you're either likely to get a filthy look, or he'll try to give you his phone number!

It's just how men are; we don't like to be seen to be weak, and that's seen as a sign of weakness. Mind you, if a guy IS on crutches, holding a baby or is really old and frail I'd certainly offer up my seat.

There's no real explanation for why we do this chivalry thing, other than that's how we were raised, and yes that was according to our parents' now-outdated moral values, but can you say it's a bad thing? Generally, you give your seat up to a woman and you'll get a smile, make someone feel they're a little special, and/or be called a gentleman. I see that as win/win.

Paying for a date, same thing. If you take a girl out and you don't pay for her you're just a cheapskate in my book, and don't deserve any. I'm not an ATM either, but I don't expect any woman to pay if I take her out. It's just politeness in my book. Her company is all the payment I need. Batlord, please stop throwing up!

Hey look: some people were brought up that way, some weren't. I ain't gonna apologise for it, and I certainly am not going to accept that it's sexist, no matter who sees it as such. Funny thing: I bet the girl I would be with would choose not to see it as a problem. Happens every time, which isn't very often, these days...

Oh, and standing up, though not practiced any more, was simply a sign of respect and good breeding. Nothing wrong with that. Mind you, if you tried to do it now you'd be laughed at. Sadly.

~~butthead aka 216~~ · 08-31-2013, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

I am generally for equality and I feel like that generally also makes me a feminist as women's rights are not as strong as men's rights in many if not most parts of the world - which might be an interesting thing to discuss.

But I feel like this whole thread is basically bringing up this strawman argument where feminism is portrayed as some sort of extremism. What you're currently discussing is not really feminism, or not a good representation of it, but rather the silly attitudes of a minority of stupid people.

Meanwhile, there is a genuine need for the sort of "moderate" feminism that most of us will probably agree is morally sound; in your society and other societies. Maybe a new thread should be made called "moderate feminism" where one can discuss women's legal rights, salaries, parental leave and so on instead of people getting angry over chivalry and politeness.

true feminism isnt always extreme but i find generally the people that label themselves feminists are on the extreme and stupid side of the fence. again, same goes for anyone lebeling themselves a male rights activists. these people are not concerned with equal rights as much as they are concerned with everyone feelin sorry for their oppresion and their extreme need for constantly standin on a soapbox

do i think there are some inequalities? sure. do i think theres very many?? do i think they are as pervasive in society as most feminists would have u believe?? no. i think its very minor and largely exagerated (see employment stats).

i also think feminists and at this point, society in general just has a general problem with accepting differences in the sexes. men are generally better at certain things. women are generally better at other certain things. why is there a constant battle to meet some kind of quotea in different sectors of the workplace?? why can we not acknowledge differences and call a spade a spade?

Burning Down · 08-31-2013, 12:05 PM

I might get flamed for this but whatever. I think whoever does the asking out on a date is responsible for paying for it. It's silly to say to someone "Can I take you out to dinner?" and then expect them to either go dutch or pay the entire bill at the end. This goes for men AND women - if you ask, then you pay.

The Batlord · 08-31-2013, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down

I might get flamed for this but whatever. I think whoever does the asking out on a date is responsible for paying for it. It's silly to say to someone "Can I take you out to dinner?" and then expect them to either go dutch or pay the entire bill at the end. This goes for men AND women - if you ask, then you pay.

The rub being that 99% of the time it's the man asking the woman out, so it's still BS.

~~butthead aka 216~~ · 08-31-2013, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down

I might get flamed for this but whatever. I think whoever does the asking out on a date is responsible for paying for it. It's silly to say to someone "Can I take you out to dinner?" and then expect them to either go dutch or pay the entire bill at the end. This goes for men AND women - if you ask, then you pay.

lol aka men pay for dates

first date ok

after that lets alternate or split the bill

~~Cuthbert~~ · 08-31-2013, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burning Down

I might get flamed for this but whatever. I think whoever does the asking out on a date is responsible for paying for it. It's silly to say to someone "Can I take you out to dinner?" and then expect them to either go dutch or pay the entire bill at the end. This goes for men AND women - if you ask, then you pay.

I don't find this unreasonable but like Batty says, it's usually men asking for the date.

If you've agreed to go on the date then you're interested in that person so I think it's polite to offer to split the bill.

~~John Wilkes Booth~~ · 08-31-2013, 12:47 PM

IMO, men are expected to pay the tab for the same reason men are expected to make the first move. In our mating ritual men are generally seen as the aggressors. If we're really worried about gender roles we should be questioning that and thinking about if it's possible to change it and somehow encourage women to be more aggressive.

08-31-2013, 12:05 PM	#166 (permalink)
Burning Down The Music Guru. Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Beyond the Wall Posts: 4,858	I might get flamed for this but whatever. I think whoever does the asking out on a date is responsible for paying for it. It's silly to say to someone "Can I take you out to dinner?" and then expect them to either go dutch or pay the entire bill at the end. This goes for men AND women - if you ask, then you pay.

08-31-2013, 12:47 PM	#170 (permalink)
~~John Wilkes Booth~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 2,235	IMO, men are expected to pay the tab for the same reason men are expected to make the first move. In our mating ritual men are generally seen as the aggressors. If we're really worried about gender roles we should be questioning that and thinking about if it's possible to change it and somehow encourage women to be more aggressive.