Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra

Eh, honestly, when I get sick I usually just eat fresh fruit, juice, and lay down for a bit. I notice that with this philosophy I get the flu far less often, and far less severely than those who are cramming anti-biotics down their throats.

I don't believe 100% in nature, but I'd rather the natural course of things control my body, than some drug. Now, if I had a very very serious disease, and there was no alternative, yes I'd take antibotics. One time when I was a child I had this miserable flu(last really major one I would have in my life), and had a temprature that registered at 104. Then, it made sense. Since, though, I don't go running to the drug store unless I'm 100% sure.

As for severe mental illness. It's too easy to get diagnosed, and it's too easy to convince a doctor to increase your dosage. It's very rarely that you'll be fully in competent hands with a doctor who has the means to properly diagnose, and as said, to be careful with drugs.

There is a lot of historical fact of the negative side effects of riddlin, lithium, etc. drugs considered to be miracle drugs, and frankly... Years later they end up having these severe side effects, but they're already in circulation, and improperly diagnosed at such a rate that they're systematic.

Again, it's like trying to cut down trees with tomahawks. Unless you're of the really wealthy, you will not get a psychiatrist who can properly analyze, and diagnose. Most cases, you'll get somebody who practices many fields, and has too many patients to focus on an individualistic case. There are better means to sort out your psychological issues. Most of them are external.

As somebody who has been plagued with a real very serious illness, I'm speaking 100% from personal experience here. Medical science is a wonderful thing but it's not without flaw. There is no reason why one must risk his, or her brain on something that may just permanently reshape it.

What about ten years from now? I mean, after all, heroine junkies feel pretty happy when they first start, right (In fact, it's probably a million times more potent than anything you'll get over the counter)? Psyche drugs are no different. If the drug hasn't been out for 10 years, there's no way you can prove that there isn't some adverse negative effect on the long term, and due to the fact we're a quick fix society, we already start diagnosing these drugs in excess without even thinking twice of any viable alternate solution.

Sansa Stark

As someone who also has a very real serious illness, I'm also speaking from experience. It doesn't "permanently reshape your brain", it's only temporary, which is why you withdraw from it.

How uneducated must you be to compare psychiatric drugs to heroin? Granted, a lot of them do provide the same thing (increase in happy chemicals in your brain) but they are not the same. You can't expect doctors to prescribe the exact thing you need. YOU should be monitoring YOUR own health and taking responsibility for YOUR sickness. They are not with you 24/7 and they don't have all the answers, they are human.

All drugs have negative effects, lots of them have extremely positive ones. I speak from experience again as I have been unable to function normally as a human being without medication. I took it as my own responsibility to track my moods and take note of my symptoms and do my research into what could help me.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra

I've read through studies that Abilify in particular is intended to have a long term effect on how the brain reshapes itself.

Personally, having such immediate negative effects, then being able to sort things out without the usage of the drug, kind of makes me question the competence of those who diagnosed me by asking me maybe 5 minutes of random questions, ones of which didn't really factor in their decision of just "diagnose the new drug, and see if it works out".

Not that I doubt that they can't have positive effects, but I believe they should - just as medicine - only used in desperation, not as a first solution to therapy, counciling, and general social activity(most effective of all of them). To say it's uneducated to not compare them to heroine is harsh. When, in fact, the only way to test drugs is monitored application.

Therefore, by the basic laws of science, there's no way to test drugs is to apply them to as many situations as possible. However, if the drug hasn't been around for a long term, it is literally impossible to assume that the drug has no long term effects, and no matter how much education you have, it's a scientific fallacy to assume there are none.

The comparison only remained relevant as something that is known to have differing long term effects, and the assumption that taking a drug for it's immediate effects is a definite indication of what it does in the long term.

Sansa Stark

I will definitely agree that Abilify is a terrible drug, as it nearly killed me, but don't hold that against all other psychiatric drugs, there are many safer options. In my recent experience with doctors, they are more than open to suggestion, which is why it's good to do your own research into medicines that have been shown to help with what you have and not permanently damage you.

It IS uneducated to speak of an opiate being the same as a psychiatric drug, and I say this with the experience of being an opiate addict. Opiates will only serve to exacerbate the mental problems, and does so for much longer than the high lasts. Psychiatric drugs aren't the same in that respect. If I stop taking the medication I take now, I'll only revert to my natural state (manic depression), however when I would stop self medicating with an opiate, I would suffer much worse.

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra

I can understand that. It's just with me, the entire serious medical world was convinced Abilify was the be all end all because of those cheesy commercials.

Maybe the problem isn't the psychiatric drugs themselves but rather the competence of the system that administers them. With that said, I think it's safe to say psychiatric drugs are ok if you are given them by a knowledgeable physician who has a good grasp on your particular case, and isn't immediately swayed/bribed to push the 'new hot drug'.

Sansa Stark

I agree, I think it's odd the new commercials don't even mention as being treatment for bipolar. It is mostly the system that administers them that really is the problem, as it cant really identify individuals. To be fair, even knowledgeable physicians can make great mistakes with medications, because people react so differently to them. Unfortunately a lot of psychiatrists/doctors are pressed to push the new hot drug, because pharmaceutical companies = $$$.

s_k

So does dying .
Don't get me wrong, I'm completely against drugs up to a certain point where nothing else helps.
I know some people who would have killed themselves a long time ago hadn't it been for the right medication.
I don't do any meds myself by the way. Probably shoud, I don't know.

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GeddyBass2112

This is true. Journalists here in the UK published an article a while ago which was pretty shocking. It detailed how drugs companies and medical companies (selling things like surgical equipment) were swaying doctors into buying their products by offering them things like free pens, posters, leaflets and even trips to seminars in expensive hotels and free holidays. This way doctors could be swayed into buying products with huge markups.

One example I can remember was a type of surgical pin. You could buy generic ones from some suppliers for a couple of $. But these companies swayed doctors into paying something like £80 ($120) a pin from their company, resulting in the NHS being WAAAAAY overcharged. The article even pointed out that an identical pin could be bought from a DIY shop for a few pence!


on the flipside of the quoted post, many doctors have a one-size-fits-all process to drugs prescriptions, and so patients often get the 'usual' drug for that specific illness. I'm on amitriptyline, which doesn't work for me personally, yet convincing my doctor to give me something else is a pain in the (b)ass because it's the 'usual' drug for depression.

zachsd

Could you elaborate on this? I've been on Abilify and have a very competent psychiatrist (at least in my opinion). I understand that there is a small potential for negative, long-term side effects, but I don't really understand your complete disregard for the drug.

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Dotoar

I'm well aware that this is not the thread for displaying personal issues but I just feel that I have to vent some air and in the process confirm the proposition that, if you'll excuse my french, nutjobs are over-represented on internet fora.

Recently I've caught myself in some strange anti-social paranoia, and have for the past two weeks been totally withdrawn from the ones I love and care for. I may or may not uphold some kind of mental condition, I wouldn't know since I've never ever encountered such things before in my life. How I'm gonna handle it is all up to me so we'll not get into that here, but I can at least assure you that I'm not aspiring to fetch a knife in the kitchen or anything.

For me it's perfectly understandable that I managed to find an asylum on this forum which I've been quite active on since I first stumbled over it a few weeks ago. I don't know anyone of you, obviously, and none of you know me as we are all spread around the world, but we all gather around one core subject which is music, one thing to which I know I can contribute thoughts and theories without having to worry about personal issues for a moment. I just want to take the opportunity to thank everyone of you on this forum for indulging in discussions that keep me occupied and motivate me to write and leave a footprint in the ocean of information that hopefully will be of use for others as well. I don't know anyone of you, like I said, but I know that I love you all!

Wow, that was a mouthful.

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