VEGANGELICA

I agree that people, men and women, should be allowed to do with their bodies what they will, including have sex for money. It isn't very different, really, from other reasons people sometimes have sex. My concern with people letting others use them sexually for money is that there is greater chance of the person being physically harmed, compared to when a person takes off her clothes while dancing...which shouldn't physically harm her at all.

Plus, I feel sexuality is something personal enough that I don't want people to be stripped of what *can* be precious and caring by having physical sexual actions turned into a commodity. If no money is being exchanged, then people are free to decide to do what they really want to do sexually without their decision-making affected by other needs or issues.

Masturbation IS great, boo boo! I feel that masturbation is often much better than sex with someone else because when you masturbate you can do exactly what feels good, and you don't have to worry about people's motivations (because you know you care about yourself)...or diseases...or pregnancy!

Also, I feel that what you said about sex and the communion of it (when there is that element to it) is very true: being able to satisfy someone else, who enjoys satisfying you in turn, is a very nice feeling. It feels lovely when someone wants to make you happy, and vice versa, as its own goal, because they care about you and especially when they love you and you love that person. Mind you...you can have all this, and orgasm, too, with someone, without actual sexual intercourse!

I feel nice men would help out a woman in desperation (say, extreme poverty with children to feed) rather than have sex with her and pay her a little bit of money for access to her body.

There are lots of nice men in the world who don't use others for their own selfish ends.

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mr dave

this doesn't make sense.

you don't get a random girl dancing her clothes off for you for free legally whenever you want, even when you're in a relationship. your significant other isn't just a collection of reactions to your actions. just because you can have sex with your partner doesn't mean you can **** them like a pornstar every time you feel like. it just doesn't work that way (it might, but then you'd be dealing with a wicked pile of crazy just waiting to explode on you).

as for the whole angle about documentaries showing 'strong', 'independent' women, how reflective of the industry do you people honestly think that is? really now. a documentary will focus on what, 2-3 women, ignoring the dozens of others in the background... i wonder, are they all up and coming med students just trying to pay their tuition? or are most of them broken little girls trying to come to terms with the abandonment issues from their youths?

i've actually worked for a company that started doing online porn hosting as a side job halfway through my time there. if that sample of 20 some odd girls was any indication of what kind of personalities end up in that situation i'd say you're lucky to find 1 out of 20 who can actually accomplish much of anything on their own. it's not that they're worthless people, not in the least, they deserve help, BUT they need to want it first, and most, are still waiting for the world to say it's sorry.

also, i've never EVER seen the kind of psychological control the queen bee exerted on her girls before or since, even on tv.

i honestly think the people trying to paint this behavior as somehow empowering or healthy are lying to themselves so they can feel better about wanting to participate in something they're able to recognize as destructive and counter productive without having to admit it to themselves. for all the 'empowerment' stripping might provide, it is completely and thoroughly overshadowed by the objectification it creates. to try arguing a social benefit to prostitution aside from a 'potential' decrease in STDs is even laughable.

also male prostitutes don't service female clients. they service other dudes. seriously, how clueless are you?

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i am the universe

midnight rain

The point is, as usual you want to blame the man for the women's problems. The women offers the service and yet you're angry at the man for taking her up on the offer?

Nice men don't exist in the sense you're describing and neither do nice women. I don't know of any nice people who actively seek out prostitutes, and then freely give them money to help them get by. Nice fantasy world you're deluding in, though.

Sansa Stark

When does she ever blame the man?

Actively nice people who give money to the poor and destitute don't exist, yeah? because there aren't charities devoted to this, and churches definitely don't do this kind of thing?

Your cynicism is very tacky, especially coupled with condescension

midnight rain

This is true, and yet prostitution still exists.

I thought Vegan made it very clear that prostitution was man's fault:
If that's not blame, then what is it?

Sansa Stark

Being that men are the main consumers of prostitutes (male and female) who else would there be to blame? Surely not the victim of their own unfortunate situation? It's their fault that they have to **** to earn anything? If you want to appropriate blame, you really think it should go to the prostitute?

midnight rain

People should take responsibility for their own lives. I don't see a need to cast blame, it's just the way things are.

I don't know any prostitutes personally, so I can't say if they really made an effort to get a legitimate job or not, they could really be that desperate or they could do it because they're too lazy to find a job or they prefer it to a job at McDonalds.

Now, if they truly can't find a job and have resorted to prostitution to be able to survive, aren't their clients helping them along? How else would they afford food? Yes, I'd love too if they had another way to make a living, but that's simply not always the reality of life. In an ideal world maybe, everybody would have a legitimate job.

Urban Hat€monger ?

I don't particularly find it empowering nor degrading.

Everybody has to earn a living somehow and in the real world not everybody will be able to do it in a way that they would like to.

If you can earn as much in one night for lying on your back that would take you a week to earn by serving in McDonalds or cleaning toilets or collecting rubbish then who am I to judge. I'm not the one that has to live with the consequences or the danger.

Any job can make you feel degraded or empowered... Welcome to the real world.

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SATCHMO

Do they have strippers in England? For some reason the Benny Hill theme music lodges in my head whenever I try to conceive of it.

ribbons

In this scenario -- prostitution for survival -- no, the clients aren't helping them along. The clients are exploiting them. I agree with Vegangelica's and Paloma's points here that there are men who would choose to help rather take advantage of a woman in such a desperate situation.