|
Register | Blogging | Today's Posts | Search |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
11-11-2009, 01:41 AM | #41 (permalink) | ||
Groupie
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nutwood, England
Posts: 27
|
Quote:
If anything, I'd say your response here merely supports what I said previously. Also, the "Merry Ol' England" comment was just a bit sad, to be honest. Quote:
As Barnard17 has pointed out, and it's something very true of my own experience, it's rarely anyone other than an American would follow this line of thinking. There's nowhere in the Western World that has the peculiar sense of nationalism that America and Americans have. There's nowhere that espouses it to the degree that Americans do, there's nowhere that articulates it in the way that Americans do and there's nowhere that turns it into a pissing contest the way that Americans do. Caveat: by 'Americans', please don't interpret 'many' for 'all'.
__________________
The Fields of Mars |
||
11-11-2009, 01:41 AM | #42 (permalink) | |
carpe musicam
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Les Barricades Mystérieuses
Posts: 7,710
|
Barnard17:
So I joke around a bit but like they say the is more truth said in jest. Yes it is disheartening for someone to say something negative about our own country or your fellow countrymen (Americans in this case) You're from England right, if I said I was an Anglophile would that make me an authority of English culture and whatever I say is more accurate then a person who lives in England? You would know that wouldn't be the case. Would you think that a person from England has a wider, more accurate perception of the country they live in? People don't like to hear something negative coming off like it the Gospel truth, because they know it's a misconception, and it should apply to everyone in that group, that is why people don't like stereo-types, they don't like being pigeon-hole and that is why I don't care for the comment. So I say something silly in response, that to me is better then how you respond, I'm none of those things you say about me. This thread is about Nationalism, but they're other things to talk about like Culture and History ect. I'm interested about Ireland saving Western culture then Irelands nationalism - I think there more there to talk about.
__________________
Quote:
"it counts in our hearts" ?ºº? “I have nothing to offer anybody, except my own confusion.” Jack Kerouac. “If one listens to the wrong kind of music, he will become the wrong kind of person.” Aristotle. "If you tried to give Rock and Roll another name, you might call it 'Chuck Berry'." John Lennon "I look for ambiguity when I'm writing because life is ambiguous." Keith Richards Last edited by Neapolitan; 11-11-2009 at 01:49 AM. |
|
11-11-2009, 01:55 AM | #43 (permalink) | |||
Groupie
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nutwood, England
Posts: 27
|
Quote:
As for pigeon-holing and stereotyping, I've not said that all Americans are like this. What I actually said, initially, was that out of all the Nationalism I've observed and experienced, the bulk of it came from Americans. There's not actually any real stereotyping there. Also, stereotyping is is usually born from pre-conceived assumptions and ideas and generalisations, whereas my comment was actually born from experience and wasn't suggesting that all Americans are like this. Quote:
Quote:
__________________
The Fields of Mars Last edited by Ulysses; 11-11-2009 at 02:03 AM. |
|||
11-11-2009, 02:48 AM | #44 (permalink) | ||
My home? Discabled,
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 204
|
Quote:
Quote:
Then don't act like you are.
__________________
Vita brevis, Occasio praeceps |
||
11-11-2009, 06:33 AM | #45 (permalink) | |
Groupie
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nutwood, England
Posts: 27
|
Quote:
It's baffling to me how many Americans can beat their chest as to being the only 'super power' in the world, a position maintained with a bewildering and alarming amount of troops and bases in outside of America, but at the same time be overly sensitive when people are unhappy with this state of affairs. It seems like there's a massive disconnect with the way many Americans see their country and how many non-Americans see it. For example, I'm sure everyone in Europe is familiar with the internet argument that America saved everyone single-handedly in WWII, as a result made the world safe in it's self-appointed role as policeman of the world. My reality is that, and it's a reality shared by many my age, I grew up in the 1970s and 1980s fully expecting to die in a nuclear holocaust purely because of our status as 'America's runway'. Again, I want to highlight the fact that England/Britain/UK has its faults, as does everywhere else. The point is that it's less likely to see a non-American aggrandising their country the way that Americans do. This is something that I see, rightly or wrongly, as being cultural and part of the fabric of American identity. As I said earlier, there's nowhere in the Western World that flag waves like America does. America has a sense of Nationalism that is unknown anywhere else in the world outside of sports events. Compare it to England, where Nationalism is practically a dirty word and is often viewed with suspicion. Compare it to Britain where there's some peculiar and ill-founded divide as to which British countries are, for want of a better word, 'allowed' or 'encouraged' to promote Nationalism in tandem to 'Britishness'. Compare it to Europe where Nationalism is very often tempered with a sense of caution born out from the spectre of the past. Compare it to the Eastern World where expressions of Nationalism, whether it's from Russia, China or North Korea &c., are somehow 'wrong' or 'threatening' to the West and in particular America.
__________________
The Fields of Mars |
|
11-11-2009, 11:48 AM | #46 (permalink) | |
My home? Discabled,
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 204
|
Quote:
Firstly old friend Russky did a hell of a lot more in combating and countering Nazi expansion than America did and it was only really by merit of the logistical headache and geographic stretch coupled with bitter winters that the Germans weren't able to be more decisive on the Western front. Secondly up to the second world war the European powers were exceptionally powerful. It was as a result of the second world war this power was lost with industrial centres and entire cities decimated, which America barely got a glimpse of themselves, and the backbone of European economies collapsing as entities within the empires sought self declaration. Thirdly, America was very clever (I doubt intentionally or maliciously so) in waiting so long to engage because it enabled the European powers to decimate each other while Germany got it's war machine into full swing. If America had entered the conflict much sooner it would have led to a much more decisive opposition to Germany, Japan may never have even had a chance to get involved and the scale of the war arena would have been much smaller. Not that I have to tell you personally, but a common espousal of American national pride is the "yeah well we saved your ass in the war" so I thought I'd throw in on that chip. This is quite simple: expression of nationalism from the listed states (albeit not so much Russia these days) is because the parades and such are organised propaganda fests largely involving people who are hired to be there and people who are forced to stand there waving a flag. They're not true displays of the sort of nationalist sentiment that, for example, you'd see at a Presidential inauguration. They're brainwashing.
__________________
Vita brevis, Occasio praeceps |
|
11-11-2009, 09:03 PM | #47 (permalink) | ||
carpe musicam
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Les Barricades Mystérieuses
Posts: 7,710
|
Quote:
I don't care if America is misjudged and hated by the world - at least we help those in need.
__________________
Quote:
"it counts in our hearts" ?ºº? “I have nothing to offer anybody, except my own confusion.” Jack Kerouac. “If one listens to the wrong kind of music, he will become the wrong kind of person.” Aristotle. "If you tried to give Rock and Roll another name, you might call it 'Chuck Berry'." John Lennon "I look for ambiguity when I'm writing because life is ambiguous." Keith Richards |
||
11-12-2009, 01:32 AM | #48 (permalink) | |||
Groupie
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nutwood, England
Posts: 27
|
Quote:
I'm not sure what relevance the Khmer Rouge have here. How were the Khmer Rouge a threat to America? The idea is laughable. The only possible threat the Khmer Rouge had was to America's influence in a part of the world thousands of miles of way from American soil. Also, if you're suggesting that the CPK were part of the 'Red Scare', then don't be taken in by 'Uncle Joe' - no, not Stalin, McCarthy. The CPK were in no way typical of any kind of 'Communism' anywhere else in the world. Quote:
Quote:
Maybe Cambodia's rice crop wasn't attractive enough a resource for the American government?
__________________
The Fields of Mars |
|||
11-12-2009, 01:44 AM | #49 (permalink) | |
Groupie
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Nutwood, England
Posts: 27
|
Quote:
Is it really that different?
__________________
The Fields of Mars |
|
11-12-2009, 03:32 AM | #50 (permalink) |
My home? Discabled,
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bristol, UK
Posts: 204
|
Yes. Human rights in the People's Republic of China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It's massively different. I'm a bit amazed you even have to ask.
__________________
Vita brevis, Occasio praeceps |