How Real Is Christianity?

Freebase Dali · 04-07-2009, 03:02 PM

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Also, I find it funny when Atheists or anybody else looking at Christianity from the outside call Christians sheep. Where it can also be argued that anybody who requires/follows money to live their lives are sheep-like as well. Everybody has to play the game to get by, nobody here is immune to it, no matter who/what you believe in.

I think the general feeling is that Christians serve God without question as a result of blind faith, whereas non-religious folks, if you apply what you said just now, require money (in today's world) as a result of necessity and needs of survival.
Those are two distinctions that need to be made.

I'm just saying all that to clarify the perspective you're speaking of.

Inuzuka Skysword · 04-07-2009, 03:07 PM

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Originally Posted by 333

I wrestled with this idea quite a bit, too. Not just in the sense of religion, but parental and societal influences in general. At one point, I realized that I've had very little control of my life. My parents never pressed their religion (buddhism) on me, but I chose to practice with them up until a few years ago. Even if they didn't, their personalities, habits and lives will forever be an influencial factor in mine - consciously or subsonsciously. Not only that, but the environment and society I was exposed to had definitely shaped me in some sort of way. It was not until I was 17 years old that I realized I was able to rebel and be my own person. I still, to this day, struggle with the idea that no thoughts are original (not even these). What we argue, say, express, fight for has been done before. Life is the epitome of "History repeats itself." Though some of what we say is worthy of repetition, with it comes the whole picture, including religion, war, power and poverty.

If this sentence is literal then disregard my post. If what you mean is that you are not the one who picks your own thoughts, then I highly disagree. You can argue for determinism all you want, but in the end too much of yourself relies on the idea that you freely choose what you believe. If you have reasoned out your beliefs then why should you even go on to think they aren't yours. Even if you are not the first to objectively create something, that does not mean you cannot enjoy the fruit of it. Hard work which leads to an output will always have consequences. If the consequence is good then you can reap from it. There is more to believing something than just creating something new. It is the state of mind of knowing that your beliefs are consistent and work with the world around you that you want. Of course, this whole time I am assuming that your life goal is the pursuit of happiness. If it isn't then no one can help you.

Quote:

Also, I find it funny when Atheists or anybody else looking at Christianity from the outside call Christians sheep. Where it can also be argued that anybody who requires/follows money to live their lives are sheep-like as well. Everybody has to play the game to get by, nobody here is immune to it, no matter who/what you believe in.

Religion is sheepish. The idea that you need money in order to live is a rational idea meaning that the idea has been reasoned out. There is no reason to believe in religion. That is the "sheep" factor of it.

Whatsitoosit · 04-07-2009, 03:09 PM

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Originally Posted by 333

I wrestled with this idea quite a bit, too. Not just in the sense of religion, but parental and societal influences in general. At one point, I realized that I've had very little control of my life. My parents never pressed their religion (buddhism) on me, but I chose to practice with them up until a few years ago. Even if they didn't, their personalities, habits and lives will forever be an influencial factor in mine - consciously or subsonsciously. Not only that, but the environment and society I was exposed to had definitely shaped me in some sort of way. It was not until I was 17 years old that I realized I was able to rebel and be my own person. I still, to this day, struggle with the idea that no thoughts are original (not even these). What we argue, say, express, fight for has been done before. Life is the epitome of "History repeats itself." Though some of what we say is worthy of repetition, with it comes the whole picture, including religion, war, power and poverty.

I view it as my parents having the right to raise me however they saw fit. All people question their beliefs at one point in their lives... it's just a part of becoming an adult. When I have kids I will raise them catholic as I believe it's good to instill some set of moral values/belief system in the child and when they reach a certain age they can make up their own mind with it. I would never say to them "this is what you MUST believe" I would leave it as... "this is what I was taught to believe and you have the ability to decide for yourself what you choose to do with this knowledge" or something to that effect. It doesn't have to be so dramatic as to call it a "crime" that children are raised to believe in a particular religion.

I agree with you on nothing we are saying here is original thought, still... it's an interesting debate that kills time

Quote:

Originally Posted by Veridical Fiction

I think the general feeling is that Christians serve God without question as a result of blind faith, whereas non-religious folks, if you apply what you said just now, require money (in today's world) as a result of necessity and needs of survival.
Those are two distinctions that need to be made.

I'm just saying all that to clarify the perspective you're speaking of.

Understandable... which is why I said "Sheep-Like". The idea that most everybody wakes up and goes to work is sheep-like... wouldn't you say? The idea that you and I need to pay the bills and alter our wants in order to do something we might prefer not to do... is sheep-like. Technically the only non sheep-like people out there, that I can think of, would be the homeless man that requires only the true basic needs for survival... food and shelter. Money is a man made concept, it's not a basic need although as you put it, it is a necessity in today's world if you don't want to become homeless

midnight rain · 04-07-2009, 03:11 PM

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Originally Posted by Inuzuka Skysword

Religion is sheepish. The idea that you need money in order to live is a rational idea meaning that the idea has been reasoned out. There is no reason to believe in religion. That is the "sheep" factor of it.

Happiness? Hope? It's pretty hard for you to speak from our perspective if you can't see our point of view anyway...

Inuzuka Skysword · 04-07-2009, 03:17 PM

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Originally Posted by zzz

Happiness? Hope? It's pretty hard for you to speak from our perspective if you can't see our point of view anyway...

Tell me how believing in an invisible man/being in the sky make you anymore happy then believing in what is in front of you.

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Happiness? Hope? It's pretty hard for you to speak from our perspective if you can't see our point of view anyway...

I was a Christian for 16 years of my life and I am now almost 17. I have read the whole bible multiple times. At points I could have been considered Evangelicial, post-modern, Mennonite (not conservative), or a lukewarm Christian. I have been through the phases and I know what it is like.

midnight rain · 04-07-2009, 03:25 PM

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Originally Posted by Inuzuka Skysword

Tell me how believing in an invisible man/being in the sky make you anymore happy then believing in what is in front of you.

I was a Christian for 16 years of my life and I am now almost 17. I have read the whole bible multiple times. At points I could have been considered Evangelicial, post-modern, Mennonite (not conservative), or a lukewarm Christian. I have been through the phases and I know what it is like.

Did you really need to quote me twice?

Does your 'experience' with Christianity entitle you to speak for everyone now?

I'm going to let this thread go, I'm whoring it to death and fighting a losing battle. :/

Good debate, people!

Whatsitoosit · 04-07-2009, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zzz

I'm going to let this thread go, I'm whoring it to death and fighting a losing battle. :/

Good debate, people!

eh, the Michael Jackson thread hit over 40 pages... you still have a ways to go

Inuzuka Skysword · 04-07-2009, 03:43 PM

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Originally Posted by zzz

Did you really need to quote me twice?

Does your 'experience' with Christianity entitle you to speak for everyone now?

The double quote was an accident.

First off, the idea that "I can't understand your point of view" hints at either:

A. Your view is irrational and only the irrational can understand.
B. You don't feel like explaining it.
C. You have no other way of arguing except to attack your opponent because you don't believe in your own point.

There could be other explanations, but they would be extraneous.

Whatsitoosit · 04-07-2009, 03:50 PM

when in doubt... always choose "C".

333 · 04-07-2009, 04:34 PM

Your scallions and sig make biology class so much more fun.

04-07-2009, 03:50 PM	#199 (permalink)
Whatsitoosit Bringer of Carrots Join Date: May 2008 Location: New York, NY Posts: 648	when in doubt... always choose "C". __________________ "It takes 43 muscles to frown and 17 to smile, but it doesn't take any to just sit there with a dumb look on your face."

04-07-2009, 04:34 PM	#200 (permalink)
333 Music Addict Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 965	Your scallions and sig make biology class so much more fun.