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View Poll Results: Physical punishment aganist children. Acceptable or Unacceptable?
Acceptable 50 56.82%
Unacceptable 38 43.18%
Voters: 88. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-02-2011, 07:58 AM   #461 (permalink)
s_k
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Lovely. .
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:07 AM   #462 (permalink)
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Lovely. .



I'll clarify a little on my stance and say that I think both ways of discipline can work, and obviously both have. Like I said, I will spank my children to teach them things - it's for their own good. I think yelling in a kids face or being a loud and angry parents is worse than giving your child a smack on their ass.

I think someone brought up the issue of when to stop the physical discipline (maybe not, thought i remembered reading that last night). But I don't think that's real clear cut, I'd just say that as cognitive functions gradually increase, spanking and stuff should decrease. If a kid knows they did something wrong, apologizes, and feel sincerely bad about it - not just bad about getting caught, then i don't think spankings are really going to do much.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:30 AM   #463 (permalink)
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People who are pro corporal punishment need to wake up, I think. Even if they think they are doing it right and are only for it under the right circumstance etc, their voiced opinion and support for corporal punishment is also enabling those who do it too much and those who abuse children. As an example, maybe you'd like to legalize a drug because you like to take it a couple of times a year. But that legalization also goes for the guy who takes that drug every day.

My conviction that corporal punishment has general negative long-term effects on the children punished and on society is not mere baseless assumption or opinion. It is based on a wealth of scientific studies.

Here are some findings and conclusions :

Corporal punishment is associated with the subsequent aggresion of children and there is recent evidence that later in life this aggression includes physical assaults on spouses.

Because corporal punishment occurs in over half of U. S. families, the findings suggest that elimination of this practice can reduce some of the psychological and social processes that increase the likelihood of future future marital violence and perhaps other violence as well.

Source : http://pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/CP23.pdf


The decline in chronic and severe corporal punishment over the last several hundred years may help explain the long historical trend to less interpersonal violence. The findings in Chapter 7 and also a great deal of other research (Bandura and Walters, 1959; Eron et al., 1971; Sears, Maccoby, and Levin, 1957) show that corporal punishment helps make many types of violence culturally legitimate. The differences between boys and girls are also consistent with this theory. It is reasonable to think that the greater likelihood of boys being hit contributes to the greater violence of men. It is time for society to develop ways to alert parents to the harmful side effects of corporal punishment of boys as well as girls.

Source : Beating the devil out of them ... - Google Bøker


The lower of the two lines shows that even when there has been no violence between the respondents' parents, a history of corporal punishment significantly increases the risk of husbands' assaultive behavior.

The parallel plot lines indicate that, regardless of whether there was violence in the current marriage, the more corporal punishment experienced as an adolescent, the greater the probability of physically abusing a child later in life.

The results in Parts A, B, and C of Table 1 have shown that corporal punishment is significantly related to depressive symptoms, suicidal thoughts, and alcohol abuse

The findings in Part D of Table 1 parallel those findings because they reveal that the more corporal punishment the subjects experienced when they were teenagers, the greater the risk that they will go beyond ordinary corporal punishment to acts that are severe enough to be classified as physical abuse.

Part C of Table 1 shows that increasing amounts of corporal punishment are associated with an increasing probability of alcohol abuse (high daily drinking or high volume binge drinking)


Source : Corporal Punishment Of Adolescents By Parents: A Risk Factor In The Epidemiology Of Depression, Suicide, Alcohol Abuse, Child Abuse, And Wife Beating - Research and Read Books, Journals, Articles at Questia Online Library


The findings support the theory that although physical punishment may produce conformity in the immediate situation, in the longer run it tends to increase the probability of deviance, including delinquency in asolescence and violent crime inside and outside the family as an adult.

Source : JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie


frequent exposure to corporal punishment increased the risk of dating violence

Source : JSTOR: An Error Occurred Setting Your User Cookie


The results indicated that batterers were more likely than comparison subjects to have been abused as children, to have witnessed their father beating their mother, and to have been disciplined as children with corporal punishment.

Source : ingentaconnect Exposure to Violence in the Families-of-Origin among Wife-Abusers...

Conclusion : Corporal punishment in general has negative (long term) effects on children and society as a whole.

Really, we should be past that debate by now. Those who support corporal punishment must do so despite the conclusions of studies like those referenced above and the wealth of other studies like them. They can continue to argue that corporal punishment is harmless, just like they can argue that evolution does not happen, but in that case; unless it's just a mere display of complete ignorance on the subject matter, they have a lot to prove and should find a wealth of evidence to support their position.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:32 AM   #464 (permalink)
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In 200 years time we'll probably be amazed at how we treated our kids, just like we are amazed about how we treated witches 200 years ago and women 100 years ago.

I hope we can somehow get in touch with eachother then .
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:34 AM   #465 (permalink)
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In 200 years time we'll probably be amazed at how we treated our kids, just like we are amazed about how we treated witches 200 years ago and women 100 years ago.

I hope we can somehow get in touch with eachother then .
But by that time people will probably be doing something else that might be deemed controversial, or abusive, or discriminatory, etc. Society will never be perfect. It's a vicious circle.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:40 AM   #466 (permalink)
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People who are pro corporal punishment need to wake up, I think. Even if they think they are doing it right and are only for it under the right circumstance etc, their voiced opinion and support for corporal punishment is also enabling those who do it too much and those who abuse children. As an example, maybe you'd like to legalize a drug because you like to take it a couple of times a year. But that legalization also goes for the guy who takes that drug every day.
I agree with you about corporal punishment but the analogy you're making with drug laws is a poor one. I'm opposed to keeping drugs illegal for much the same reason I'm opposed to corporal punishment for children, because I feel that both have a negative impact on individuals and on society as a whole.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:46 AM   #467 (permalink)
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I'm not sure I like the idea of 'corporal punishment' being lumped into one definition.

Like I said previously in the thread I can count on one hand the number of times I was smacked as a kid and I was always made aware of why I got them. So am I being defined in the same way as someone who was hit everyday for the smallest reason?
Are those 4 or 5 smackings going to make me a violent drunk later in life?

That's why I'm always dubious of studies like these.
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Old 02-02-2011, 10:48 AM   #468 (permalink)
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I agree with you about corporal punishment but the analogy you're making with drug laws is a poor one. I'm opposed to keeping drugs illegal for much the same reason I'm opposed to corporal punishment for children, because I feel that both have a negative impact on individuals and on society as a whole.
Actually, I agree with you that it was a pretty bad analogy. Some parts work while others don't, so I was a bit hasty with that one .. Too late to undo.

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I'm not sure I like the idea of 'corporal punishment' being lumped into one definition.

Like I said previously in the thread I can count on one hand the number of times I was smacked as a kid and I was always made aware of why I got them. So am I being defined in the same way as someone who was hit everyday for the smallest reason?
Are those 4 or 5 smackings going to make me a violent drunk later in life?

That's why I'm always dubious of studies like these.
That's why it says "in general". It means that perhaps not every possible individual scenario would show that corporal punishment is net negative, but the studies show that corporal punishment on the whole has a net negative effect. It's reasonable to assume that a decrease in corporal punishment will also lead to a decrease in other forms of violence in society.

If you want to take a stance on a law, for example one which prohibits corporal punishment, you should take a stance based on the general effect that law will have on society.
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Old 02-02-2011, 11:36 AM   #469 (permalink)
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But by that time people will probably be doing something else that might be deemed controversial, or abusive, or discriminatory, etc. Society will never be perfect. It's a vicious circle.
Absolutely. It's not so much as a circle. I guess we will just change till one day the earth goes boom.
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Old 02-02-2011, 12:07 PM   #470 (permalink)
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That's why it says "in general". It means that perhaps not every possible individual scenario would show that corporal punishment is net negative, but the studies show that corporal punishment on the whole has a net negative effect.
I think you're confusing discipline with abuse.

Getting drunk and beating a kid every single day because they annoy you is completely different from smacking a child once in a blue moon because they've been doing something extremely awful repeatedly and aren't responding to any other kind of discipline.

Giving a child a 'smack' usually means something you do very rarely as a last resort and it tends to be a tiny fraction of your strength on an area where they're least sensitive (E.G you don't throw a right hook full force at their throat).



I'd be surprised to see how many of the people in this thread have kids or have had to look after kids at any point of their life. It seems like the people against the smacking are blowing it out of proportion, looking at some of the posts in here you would think they've mistaken 'discipline' for the word 'disembowelment'.
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