the *** sex & religion thread (country, cover, quote, Inci)

[cardboard adolescent]

life is meaningless

or, if you want a slightly less biased approach, meaning is constructed. sometimes rather shabbily, as with ayn rand, who bases it around the need to survival. everyone wants to survive but that doesn't mean that survival is somehow meaningful in itself, it has to be given meaning by the human subject. if you're not relying on the bible to hand down meaning then all you have to rely on are the words of other people, ie humanity ie yourself. which is the same thing as saying that meaning is constructed which is the same thing as saying that in itself life is meaningless. might i suggest reading myth of sisyphus?

[Inuzuka Skysword]

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

life is meaningless

or, if you want a slightly less biased approach, meaning is constructed. sometimes rather shabbily, as with ayn rand, who bases it around the need to survival. everyone wants to survive but that doesn't mean that survival is somehow meaningful in itself, it has to be given meaning by the human subject. if you're not relying on the bible to hand down meaning then all you have to rely on are the words of other people, ie humanity ie yourself. which is the same thing as saying that meaning is constructed which is the same thing as saying that in itself life is meaningless. might i suggest reading myth of sisyphus?

Yeah, but if you give it meaning then life isn't meaningless anymore. Basically, I want to know exactly why you choose to exist anymore. If you don't live for yourself then there is no reason for your existence unless you want to be a slave.

I'm going to systematically destroy Rand's stupid argument and that whole article. I'll respond in a few days because I'm not going to dedicate a huge chunk of time towards it.

That's fine. I back out of debates all the time due to school. I am surprised I am staying in this one with midterm projects/tests coming up.

[streetwaves]

Originally Posted by Inuzuka Skysword

Yeah, but if you give it meaning then life isn't meaningless anymore.

i agree. meaning is a man-made concept, and therefore the only relevant (or even possible) meaning is assigned by man.

[sleepy jack]

I'm going to systematically destroy Rand's stupid argument and that whole article. I'll respond in a few days because I'm not going to dedicate a huge chunk of time towards it.

[sleepy jack]

Looking at the length this might take me longer than a few days ;_;. So when you see a two page post by me you'll know it's done.

[cardboard adolescent]

To be or not to be, that is the question;
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing, end them. To die, to sleep;
No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to — 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;
To sleep, perchance to dream. Ay, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come,
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause. There's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life,
For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
Th'oppressor's wrong, the proud man's contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law's delay,
The insolence of office, and the spurns
That patient merit of th'unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscovered country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will,
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?
Thus conscience does make cowards of us all,
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pitch and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action.

[cardboard adolescent]

nevertheless at some point you have to face the fact that any meaning you have created is constructed out of nothing and will be undone by death

[Inuzuka Skysword]

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

nevertheless at some point you have to face the fact that any meaning you have created is constructed out of nothing and will be undone by death

The meaning is created so that I might find happiness. It isn't created because I want to find truth. My life's purpose is to find happiness as I said earlier.

[cardboard adolescent]

Originally Posted by streetwaves

i'm obviously aware that any meaning in my life is constructed out of nothing, but how is that relevant?

by the way, your statement that "life is meaningless" makes no sense unless meaning exists in the first place.

that's not true, meaning is a property of language and not of life. language is something we drape over life, and we have a bad habit of confusing the two. of course, then meaninglessness is also simply a property of language and not of life, but the statement is trying to express something that can't really be put into words... an existential rather than intellectual truth, if you will.

Originally Posted by Inuzuka Skysword

The meaning is created so that I might find happiness. It isn't created because I want to find truth. My life's purpose is to find happiness as I said earlier.

who isn't looking for happiness? but there's a big gap between hedonism and objective meaning and morality. i understand that i am a pleasure-seeking being but if anything that makes my life seem more meaningless, since i know all pleasures are transitory and will just be replaced by another yearning, and so on, and so on, until i die.

[Inuzuka Skysword]

Originally Posted by cardboard adolescent

who isn't looking for happiness? but there's a big gap between hedonism and objective meaning and morality. i understand that i am a pleasure-seeking being but if anything that makes my life seem more meaningless, since i know all pleasures are transitory and will just be replaced by another yearning, and so on, and so on, until i die.

You are what you are though. Why would you yearn for something beyond reality if you know that you cannot have it? Don't you want to make the most out of existence? Pleasure is what we have and it is best to deal with it instead of yearning for something that doesn't exist.