This I Believe There is / is not a God

chanpyn · 02-13-2011, 10:49 AM

I believe that there is nothing but forever, and since we are temporary all the Gods have formed in an attempt to personalize what we cannot mentally grasp. Everyone is right and Everyone is wrong, somewhere in between is the truth.

TockTockTock · 02-13-2011, 01:02 PM

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Originally Posted by Maccabbe

The Catholic's Church official approval of the Theory of Evolution is scandalous. Not only because this theory is pure speculation and also not proven and also disproved by its greatest 'followers' like Darwin and Huxley among others as I have provided with the direct names of the books, publications, articles, the page numbers and so on, but also because its going hand in hand with those who want to explain this universe without God.
If from the outset you claim that God had nothing to do with the creation of the universe, and you even claim that God doesn’t exist to begin with, I find it heretical and down rite shameful for any institution that claims to be religious to join hand in hand with those who hate God, and be sure that these scientists hate god and religion, as Sir Arthur Keith said :" Evolution is unproved and unprovable. We believe it only because the only alternative is special creation, and that is unthinkable".

The human being has a greater opportunity to reach spiritual heights then the angels because angels do not have 'choice' they do as they are told, but humans have both the good and the bad inclinations, and when they struggle and choose goodness instead of evilness then their reward is way more higher and greater.

Did anyone achieve this?

The entire Torah is filled with this, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, Joseph and the other 11 Tribes , such as Reuben Shimon, Levi, Judah, Benjamin and so on. Also Moses, his disciple Joshua, Aaron and his two Sons, Elezar and Itamar, then King Saul and King David and his Son King Solomon, and the Prophets of Israel such as Samuel, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Amos, Joel, Elijah and Nathan among others, and the Great Talmudic Sages such as Rabbi Akiva, Rabbi Shimon Bar Yochi the author of the Zohar, Rabbi Yossi, Rabbi Hillel, Rabbi Shamai, Rabbi Jonathan the Son of Uziel and so on.

Not only these Great Men surpassed any angel, but they have surpassed nature itself, and were able to do miracles. For example in the Torah it says that when the Jews were rescued by God from the hands of the Egyptians and they came to the Red Sea, the sea didn’t want to part in front of Moses, but when it saw the Bones of Joseph, it right away parted.

As you might know, Joseph made the Jewish people swear that when the God of Israel will redeem them, they should carry his remains back to his city 'Shechem' in Israel and not leave him in Egypt, so when the Red Sea saw the Arch of Joseph, it ran away from it and parted in front of the Children of Israel.

What is the connection between the sea parting and Joseph's Arch?

This world and the human being is made up of 4 elements, Fire, Wind, Dust and Water. All human characteristics are connected to these 4 elements. When a person is lazy, this is connected to Dust, as it pulls him down towards the ground, and therefore he is lazy. Anger is connected to fire, Wind is connected to arrogance, and water is the root of all desires.

In the Torah Joseph is described as 'Joseph the Righteous' because he was able to win over the inclination of having relations with the wife of Potifar when she was seducing him every day and every night while he was a servant in the house of Potifar. She had immense beauty, and he was all alone, the only Jew in a nation that worshiped abominations and promiscuity and impurity. Nevertheless he never forgot what his Great father Jacob had taught him, and he remained a God fearing man and righteous in a sea of wickedness and evilness. Thus Joseph was able to subdue the desires that were rooted and connected to the element of 'WATER' and thus when the Sea that is made of water saw Joseph's arch, it couldn’t but part because when a person masters these 4 elements that are found in him, he then can master nature itself, this is the power that is given to human beings, and this is what every human being can reach, as the famous Jewish teaching says : Every person can be as righteous as Moses or as wicked as Pharaoh', the choice is there for everyone to take.

As to hating one's self and as to 'been moral', well any human being that agrees to the awful vituperation of been called an ape , hates himself in one way or another, for naturally when someone approaches you and he says extreme insults, you get upset and angry and want to defend yourself and your dignity, but what has happened with this 'Ape thing' why people are not getting insulted for it is the worst that a person can call you, the worst.

As to morals,

True morality is only what God says, not what an individual or a number of people or a particular society decided to be. So, if you are not doing what God wants you to do, you are an immoral person, only when you do what he expects you to do then you become a righteous person.

The Torah considers those who don’t believe in God to be wicked.
So you can be a 'moral atheist' that is nice to your neighbors and smiles at people and friends, and gives charity and clothes the naked, and feeds the poor, but if you missed the entire main point which is to recognize God as your master and as the Master of all things and the entire universe, then according to God, you are wicked. And remember there is absolutely no room for atheists in heaven or in the World to come, and that includes Jews who don’t believe in God. Been a Jew is not a free ticket to enter heaven or have a share in the world to come, Judaism demands action, action of the mind and action of the body, that means in your mind you must believe in God, and to demonstrate this belief you must do physical actions that God wants you to do, and if you adhere to all of this, then you are called a Righteous.

As I said, to be righteous is a very daunting task, but its worth it to work on getting the right ticket to the train that Goes To heaven instead of jumping in the train that goes to hell. The train that goes to hell has lots of delicacies, great food and wine, beautiful women, abundance of entertainment, and many ways to 'Enjoy the Ride‘, this is the devil's doing, he is casting a darkness onto your eyes, telling you to enter his train, for its so tempting and so 'good', and the vast majority of people enter this train, but they don’t know that this train is only temporary, and its final destination is bitter and painful for eternity.

The other train is very modest, some bread and cheese, and simple water, you'll get laughed at and persecuted for your beliefs, would have to pass through many tests and obstacles, many confusions will be present, you will see things that will make you doubt in the existence of God, you will have to survive on little, and all along you will hear the great 'joy' coming out from the other 'comfortable' train that rides side by side next to your train.

This will make your ride even more doubtful and painful, but the only thing that comforts your body and soul is the fact that this train is the train that Goes to the Destination of Light and spiritual everlasting pleasure and goodness , enjoying the close proximity of God and been among his Righteous, sitting down with a crown on your head and been praised as one of God's true servants, and been given an honorary location within heaven, sitting down together with the Righteous and exploring and knowing God and growing in understanding of him.

I think that its worth it to suffer a little in this world, in order to reach home of your soul, for your soul in this world is only a guest, and it never finds true happiness here, but when its returned to its original root, where it was first created, there is a feeling of coming home, been next to God, and that is true happiness and enjoyment.

Regards,

Saul

All I can do is laugh....
Anyways, go to google.com and click the search box. Once you see the flashing line, this indicates for you to then type in the desired search option. I would like you to type in "Christian Forums" and find a site that suits you so you can go give your e-sermons to other delusional people like yourself. It's enough that I have to put up with this crap all the time where I live... It's like Tore said, if you cannot respond reasonable to their criticisms and form a coherent argument, then there is no point in your continuing on this topic.

Guybrush · 02-13-2011, 01:38 PM

Maccabbe, I realize that you are too deep in what I percieve as lies to be swayed by any argument I can make. If we removed your faith, your life would come tumbling down. Hence, protecting it by any means necessary is something you would do both consciously and subconsciously. So, trying to make you see what I think is reason is obviously futile.

You took time to answer my questions, though, which is nice. It seems to me that you think that man should strive to become better than angels and that when this is achieved, they are able to do magic in the way of performing miracles. So, is it your goal to reach this level of spirituality where you can perform miracles? And what sort of miracle do you see yourself doing should you ever achieve this?

~~Maccabbe~~ · 02-13-2011, 03:50 PM

I have made a rule when talking to people about these topics:

Ignore accusations and things that have nothing to do with the discussion.

**Janszoon** · 02-13-2011, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maccabbe

I have made a rule when talking to people about these topics:

Ignore accusations and things that have nothing to do with the discussion.

That's ironic considering how many accusations and things that have nothing to do with the discussion you've been throwing around.

s_k · 02-13-2011, 06:10 PM

Are we having a war yet?

.

Howard the Duck · 02-14-2011, 12:16 AM

^^ jihad!!!!!!!!!

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 02-14-2011, 01:42 AM

This is one of my favorite posts of all time:

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Originally Posted by Maccabbe

Everything just to make religion look bad, even lie and deceit, any norm is broken just to achieve hatred towards religion, and that's pitiful and shameful.

Including directly quoting the bible's pro-genocidal tendencies?

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Colleges today are infested with sex parties and drugs, young girls are getting drunk and are having sex with complete strangers, because that's 'what's in' today. Atheism respects everything that has to do with breaking morals and decency.

Good.

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Britney Spears, and Justine Bieber who doesn’t even understand what love is all about yet he sings about love and sex, are the heroes of the liberal and atheist movements, and these idiotic 'role models; are poisoning the minds of the young generation of teens all around the world, to cast the yoke of heaven to the ground, to forget the almighty, and indulge in acts of profanities and impurities, and abominations, all the things that God Hates.

Yes, but they are not preaching genocide against the non-believers. Which is worse, genocide, or sex? Even weird sex is natural, as long as it's not obsessive.

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And its way better to get lashes in this world , a world that passes on, and is temporary, then to be punished in fires of hell for eternity.

That scares the **** out of me. So, the only way to heal your sins is to subject yourself to torture?

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God saw into the future and knew that without creating laws of separation between the sexes, people will be ready to do the most vile and deplorable sins, like premarital sex, promiscuity, immodesty, and lunacy among others.

But, not genocide. Genocide is good as long as you kill gays, and non-believers. Like Moses blatantly commands his preachers practice in.

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Therefore he wrote in Holy Torah divine commandments to teach humanity how to live properly and how to safeguard the purity of the family and the moral fabric of society.

Yes, and execute homosexuals, and buy women you just raped from their fathers. Execute all non-virginal brides, and magicians. The old testament is full of wonderful advice, especially when it praises valiant heroes for chopping up the children of evil empires.

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And the Jewish people were hated precisely because of that all throughout the generations, because there are many millions even billions of people around the world who want to live a life bereft of any higher calling, or spiritual purpose. The Jew reminded them of the truth of God and his ways, and people just cant stand the student in the class who points his finger and says that they must behave like human beings and not like animals.

Jewish secularism is quite common, as is liberal Judaism. All of the horrors that have existed to the Jewish people(even if you assume the fact that the story of Egyptians enslaving the Jews probably was completely fabricated) is advised to Israeli citizens to do in the bible. That is A) commit genocide, B) Hire slaves from war torn countries, C) build special favor for Israelis as an ethnic group over others within the country of Israel.

A lot of Jews maintain what they do out of pride of heritage, but even many practicing Jews question some of the blatantly out of date moral guidance of the Torah.

I personally love Jews, and have countless Jew heroes(John Zorn, Gyorgie Ligeti, Lenny Bruce, Mel Brooks, Carla Kihlstead, 90% of the original line-up of Simpsons writers, etc.) but it doesn't mean that the Jewish holy book the Torah, or as it's known Old Testament, isn't ****ing terrifying from a moral perspective.

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The Mythical Evolution movement is in direct opposition to what God wants in this universe, the exact opposite. God created a human being and gave him tools to achieve things that would make him even higher then the Angels, in fact it is mentioned in Sacred Jewish books that when the Angels saw Adam (the first human being) for the first time, they called him 'Holy', that's how lofty and high was the status of the first human being, that even the angels have called him 'Holy'. Yet some scientists want to turn this great and holy creation of God, into an ape bereft of any connection to the heavens.

If I remember right, God actually created Adam from a clump of dirt. So, I'd buy the ape thing more.

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Some people find it very appealing to be an animal and not 'Holy', for been 'Holy' is a great responsibility, things are expected from you, and you must conduct yourself accordingly, but been an ape? who cares, just do and act like a monkey, there is no ultimate truth to anything, there is nothing divine everything is just atoms and molecules.

Acting like a monkey would kick ass. I could just throw my feces at my enemies.

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What a disgusting and shameful way of living in this world, hating yourself so much that you are willing to become an animal just so that you will achieve this fictional 'freedom' from God.

What the **** did monkeys ever do to you? I mean, yeesh... they're cute, cuddly, and sell kids movies like hotcakes.

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But the soul of the human being is naturally longing to serve God, and follow his ways. Any human being deep in his heart of hearts, has a point of truth , and he knows this truth, yet in this dark world there are so many layers of lies covering this truth, and many are caving in and are following the easy way, the crowed and do as the majority does.

So wait... When I see a decadent image and get an erection. That's not nature? I can't control it, though. Will God help me stop getting erections? I mean, of course my boners contradict the real nature of me, and the truth deep inside.

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But let me tell you, Hell is packed, but in heaven there is way more room.

So, if Hell's packed... then I'm not going there? Or, do I need reservations?

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It takes hard work and dedication, and acceptance to be among the righteous, but to be wicked? its very easy to be wicked, you just follow what the majority does, and you will buy yourself a one way ticket to hell for ever and ever.

Uh... yes, but it's against all of your natural wills, and truths your heart secretly harbors.

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The choice is all yours, and no one is going to make the choice for you.
You have to know where you want to be.

I like where I am now, and it's mostly because I make immoral choices.

Howard the Duck · 02-14-2011, 05:49 AM

i think most of the thing stems from a tribe of Jews who just happened to worship Yahweh given more prominence because that tribe was victorious and killed more people?

coulda been Beelzebub's tribe, coulda been Baal's tribe

hell even coulda been Lucifer's tribe

Ska Lagos Jew Sun Ra · 02-14-2011, 07:57 AM

Well, being violent, and warlike, was the only way to survive at the time, really. If you were not, and your next door neighbor was, you were ****ed. Just as any developing culture, they had to start with violence, and intimidation to keep their people in order.

Again, I have nothing against Jews, especially in the modern form. I think Jews though as a cultural, and ethnic group have had an astounding positive effect on our society. Doesn't mean you can't ignore the facts of what it really says in the bible.

02-13-2011, 01:38 PM	#803 (permalink)
Guybrush Juicious Maximus III Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Scabb Island Posts: 6,525	Maccabbe, I realize that you are too deep in what I percieve as lies to be swayed by any argument I can make. If we removed your faith, your life would come tumbling down. Hence, protecting it by any means necessary is something you would do both consciously and subconsciously. So, trying to make you see what I think is reason is obviously futile. You took time to answer my questions, though, which is nice. It seems to me that you think that man should strive to become better than angels and that when this is achieved, they are able to do magic in the way of performing miracles. So, is it your goal to reach this level of spirituality where you can perform miracles? And what sort of miracle do you see yourself doing should you ever achieve this? __________________ Something Completely Different

02-13-2011, 06:10 PM	#806 (permalink)
s_k Music Addict Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,206	Are we having a war yet? . __________________ Click here to see my collection

02-13-2011, 10:49 AM	#801 (permalink)
chanpyn Groupie Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New Jersey Posts: 19	I believe that there is nothing but forever, and since we are temporary all the Gods have formed in an attempt to personalize what we cannot mentally grasp. Everyone is right and Everyone is wrong, somewhere in between is the truth.

02-13-2011, 03:50 PM	#804 (permalink)
~~Maccabbe~~ Account Disabled Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: New York City Posts: 34	I have made a rule when talking to people about these topics: Ignore accusations and things that have nothing to do with the discussion.

02-14-2011, 12:16 AM	#807 (permalink)
Howard the Duck Live by the Sword Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Posts: 9,075	^^ jihad!!!!!!!!!

02-14-2011, 05:49 AM	#809 (permalink)
Howard the Duck Live by the Sword Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Posts: 9,075	i think most of the thing stems from a tribe of Jews who just happened to worship Yahweh given more prominence because that tribe was victorious and killed more people? coulda been Beelzebub's tribe, coulda been Baal's tribe hell even coulda been Lucifer's tribe