The Wow I Can't Believe That News Story Thread

[OccultHawk]

If I sound like a teenage goth it's only because I didn't grow out of the truth.

[Chula Vista]

Let's remember that the Civil War, at its core, was about those southern states wanting to keep their slaves (to stay very rich) and ignoring the basic tenants of the United States Constitution:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.”

So the leaders of the southern movement were a bunch of rich white men who didn't want to give up their free labor, and who convinced thousands and thousand of young men through BS propaganda (sound familiar?) that it was some sort of noble cause that made killing other Americans justified.

Lee, at various points during his military career, instructed his troops to capture any free blacks they came across and to return them to the south so they could be enslaved again.

When you have some time give this a read. Again, sound familiar?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lost_C...he_Confederacy

[Frownland]

Originally Posted by The Batlord

I could give a **** about the Confederacy, but they're still the South's ancestors and they bled and died for their homes and families and country and whatnot, same as any US soldier in any other war, so I see no reason not to commemorate the soldiers themselves.

I have ancestors that fought in every American war since the Mayflower and they were a bunch of ****s for it.

[Janszoon]

Maduro's son threatens to 'take the White House' with guns in case of U.S. intervention - POLITICO

"If the U.S. soils the homeland, the rifles would come to New York and take the White House," Maduro Guerra said according to reports from Venezuelan media.

#GeographyFail

[Cuthbert]

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Maduro's son threatens to 'take the White House' with guns in case of U.S. intervention - POLITICO



#GeographyFail

I think quite a lot of people would think that tbh.

[Zhanteimi]

Originally Posted by Frownland

I have ancestors that fought in every American war

[Frownland]

Originally Posted by elphenor

A lot of Republicans were against slavery on moral grounds straight up

A significant portion of the party would continue to push for African American rights after the war too, even reparations

That was before LBJ or whatever the crossing over point was, so they were essentially Democrats though.

[OccultHawk]

Very few. Mostly, it was these southern planters have an unfair economic advantage and they're bringing African savages into the country. Slave owners at least wanted to protect their property. Non-slave owners were either apathetic or just wanted a simple way to get rid of the blacks. There's documents of white abolitionists with decent intentions but their prevelance in society is deeply exaggerated. It was met with the concern we have of a mosquito eradication program today. Nobody cares about the mosquitos. It's all about how does this affect everything else.

[Lisnaholic]

Originally Posted by elphenor

this is an interesting take but nobody worth appeasing gets angry over a confederate statue being removed

I mean really consider the reason they're mad about it

Nazis can catch these hands

^ Thanks, elphenor. Sorry, but I really don't understand the bolded bit.

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Why was it a mistake? Lee lead a treasonous army that attacked and killed thousands of members of the US military, that's not typically something we memorialize here.

I can see that it's still a very contentious issue in a country that isn't mine and I don't want to disrespect the feelings of Americans. Everyone can see that the Civil War was a huge tragedy; huge partly because the country was so evenly divided, and at the time Lee was a military hero to many Americans. The Civil War is now part of American history, as in fact is the statue itself. How long has it been standing there without exciting comment? Why not leave historical memorials in place, even if they commemorate things or people that are controvertial by modern standards of thinking? Another way to show disdain for Robert E. Lee would be to put a new, dated, plaque under the statue explaining when the statue was put up and how his cause is now largely discredited, but please leave your historical artifacts in place.
When a dictator is overthrown, it's very common that his statues are destroyed in the excitement of victory, but that doesn't apply in this case and imo no country should go around smashing up the monuments it doesn't approve of.

Originally Posted by Chula Vista

Let's remember that the Civil War, at its core, was about those southern states wanting to keep their slaves (to stay very rich) and ignoring the basic tenants of the United States Constitution:

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.”

^ Strictly speaking, the Civil War was about Federal vs State control; the whole issue of slavery was just an add on from Lincoln after they had already been fighting for years:-

While not all Southerners saw themselves as fighting to preserve slavery, most of the officers and over a third of the rank and file in Lee's army had close family ties to slavery. To Northerners, in contrast, the motivation was primarily to preserve the Union, not to abolish slavery. Abraham Lincoln consistently made preserving the Union the central goal of the war, though he increasingly saw slavery as a crucial issue and made ending it an additional goal.

Originally Posted by Janszoon

Maduro's son threatens to 'take the White House' with guns in case of U.S. intervention - POLITICO



#GeographyFail

^ lol. Invasion 101: buy a map of the place you plan to invade.

[Frownland]

Originally Posted by Lisnaholic

^ Thanks, elphenor. Sorry, but I really don't understand the bolded bit.

It means he's gonna go punch up some Nazifolk.

How long has it been standing there without exciting comment?

Zero years.

Why not leave historical memorials in place, even if they commemorate things or people that are controvertial by modern standards of thinking? Another way to show disdain for Robert E. Lee would be to put a new, dated, plaque under the statue explaining when the statue was put up and how his cause is now largely discredited, but please leave your historical artifacts in place.
When a dictator is overthrown, it's very common that his statues are destroyed in the excitement of victory, but that doesn't apply in this case and imo no country should go around smashing up the monuments it doesn't approve of.

I actually think it's a lot more similar to the dictator analogy than you realize tbh. Lee is essentially a leader of a foreign country that laid stake on US soil.