Rishi Sunak says 'a man is a man and a woman is a woman'

SGR · 12-19-2023, 06:10 PM

Elph, I thought you were dead. Did Satan send you back up to us as punishment?

Mindy · 12-19-2023, 07:15 PM

elph, where did your 14,000+ posts go?

The Batlord · 12-19-2023, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mindfulness

elph, where did your 14,000+ posts go?

He doesn't want his next girlfriend knowing what he said about the mail.

WWWP · 12-21-2023, 08:08 AM

Omg now I understand why my packages are all delayed

jadis · 12-26-2023, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

you can't lie about your gender because it's a self-identifier anyway

you just are what you say you are when it comes to gender

typically people present as their gender but even that isn't what makes a man or woman

I agree completely. I just think that it is this hollow usage that makes it, today, a pretty useless concept. "Whatever you say bro" cannot be at the basis of any meaningful social category.

Quote:

Originally Posted by elphenor

sex may need to be considered in the case of trans women in sports, it's definitely complicated

however it's so clear that you're using the issue as a vehicle for your transphobia that I don't know why you'd even bother being disingenuous

I opened this thread as an attempt to dodge the transphobia allegations but seems like somebody's finally seen through my elaborate charade.

Don't remember if I stated this on this forum or on the other but I feel very differently about those who transition to opt out of their gender* (typically women) compared to those who seek entry into another (typically men, MTFs). For the former I feel lots of compassion, for the latter not so much. The one is about escaping restrictive categories, the other about reifying them, not to mention enforcing a punitive bureacracy around the whole thing.

*Meaning here the set of societal conventions and expectations that you don't choose, so the opposite of an "inner identity"

elphenor · 12-27-2023, 02:53 PM

the use of "today" implies that there was some mystical time period where gender wasn't a social construct

but it's not the case

gender has always been performative self-identification, and furthermore, some form of transgenderism is observable in pretty much every civilization we've been able to closely study

jadis · 01-01-2024, 07:27 AM

Eddie Izzard fails bid to become Labour candidate for Brighton Pavilion seat

Izzard (now a failed politician, in the past one of Britain's greatest ever comedians) is a good illustration of the new turn. He was cross-dressing since the 1980s, when it was a matter of playful subversion of gender stereotypes and it had never occured to him then that he was in any sense a woman.

Now he claims he's literally a woman. Yet what it means in effect is that he leans into stereotypes of gender presentation that natal women/women born women/ biological women/ real (yep) women no longer have any use for.

Synthgirl · 01-01-2024, 10:09 AM

Cis women have no use for skirts, heels, makeup… pink jackets? Your takes are getting more ridiculous every day.

jadis · 01-01-2024, 10:22 AM

There are two very different relationships to gender stereotypes in this photo. You see women who don't need to resort or subscribe to any gender stereotypes to "perform" femininity because that's just what they are, each in her own ways. And you see... well, something else. Someone whose sole link to femininity is those accessories.

Synthgirl · 01-01-2024, 12:02 PM

Trans people are not a monolith, most of us don’t dress like that all the time, and that includes me. This is me last night, no “feminine stereotypes”, still a woman. We’re multifaceted three dimensional human beings.

12-19-2023, 07:15 PM	#132 (permalink)
Mindy ask me about cosmology Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Milky Way Galaxy Posts: 9,023	elph, where did your 14,000+ posts go? __________________ https://www.instagram.com/shhons_meme_agency

12-19-2023, 06:10 PM	#131 (permalink)
SGR No Ice In My Bourbon Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: /dev/null Posts: 4,326	Elph, I thought you were dead. Did Satan send you back up to us as punishment?

01-01-2024, 07:27 AM	#137 (permalink)
jadis Music Addict Join Date: Jun 2021 Location: dont ask Posts: 1,359	Eddie Izzard fails bid to become Labour candidate for Brighton Pavilion seat Izzard (now a failed politician, in the past one of Britain's greatest ever comedians) is a good illustration of the new turn. He was cross-dressing since the 1980s, when it was a matter of playful subversion of gender stereotypes and it had never occured to him then that he was in any sense a woman. Now he claims he's literally a woman. Yet what it means in effect is that he leans into stereotypes of gender presentation that natal women/women born women/ biological women/ real (yep) women no longer have any use for.

01-01-2024, 10:09 AM	#138 (permalink)
Synthgirl Music Addict Join Date: Jan 2023 Location: Cheeseland USA Posts: 155	Cis women have no use for skirts, heels, makeup… pink jackets? Your takes are getting more ridiculous every day.

01-01-2024, 10:22 AM	#139 (permalink)
jadis Music Addict Join Date: Jun 2021 Location: dont ask Posts: 1,359	There are two very different relationships to gender stereotypes in this photo. You see women who don't need to resort or subscribe to any gender stereotypes to "perform" femininity because that's just what they are, each in her own ways. And you see... well, something else. Someone whose sole link to femininity is those accessories.

01-01-2024, 12:02 PM	#140 (permalink)
Synthgirl Music Addict Join Date: Jan 2023 Location: Cheeseland USA Posts: 155	Trans people are not a monolith, most of us don’t dress like that all the time, and that includes me. This is me last night, no “feminine stereotypes”, still a woman. We’re multifaceted three dimensional human beings.