pc issue of the day pt. 4:33 isn't music

**Frownland** · 07-06-2015, 06:39 PM

^did you record it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

It may very well, but that doesn't mean you have to accept his interpretation as gospel, or that it is inherently correct. He might believe that vaccines cause autism, after all.

That doesn't have anything to do with the art though. I mean, Jim Carrey still had some funny movies and I wouldn't doubt him if he said he was trying to be funny in the other ones. He's still a lame anti-vaxxer. Generally people are aware of their thoughts when they create something from scratch, so I'm going to go on taking them at their word when they describe their intentions.

That's not to mention that dictating what art isn't is far more pretentious than anything that's attempting to challenge those preconceived notions.

The Batlord · 07-06-2015, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkeDaddy

The tacos I had for dinner today are music

And you can't debate that because I said so and I'm the one that had the tacos.

^^ genre-bending musical masterpiece

Now kiss my feet Frownland

Give it an hour, and then you'll be making some real music.

The Batlord · 07-06-2015, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

That doesn't have anything to do with the art though. I mean, Jim Carrey still had some funny movies and I wouldn't doubt him if he said he was trying to be funny in the other ones. He's still a lame anti-vaxxer.

Whatever, Trollheart.

Quote:

Generally people are aware of their thoughts when they create something from scratch, so I'm going to go on taking them at their word when they describe their intentions.

Generally people also are full of **** in some form or another, so I don't see why I shouldn't question them.

Quote:

That's not to mention that dictating what art isn't is far more pretentious than anything that's attempting to challenge those preconceived notions.

On this forum, your position seems to the conventional one, so I'm the iconoclast here

. And from what I can see, a lot of people hold your point of view, not so much because they actually believe it, but because they don't want to be seen as the kind of person who doesn't "get art". Which is pretty pretentious.

**Frownland** · 07-06-2015, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Batlord

On this forum, your position seems to the conventional one, so I'm the iconoclast here

. And from what I can see, a lot of people hold your point of view, not so much because they actually believe it, but because they don't want to be seen as the kind of person who doesn't "get art". Which is pretty pretentious.

Really? I just figured that they were the type of people who respect the artist's word on their own music. Seems like a no brainer for me. I would respect a carpenter's claim that the chair he made was made out of hardwood oak much in the same way. Sure, they could be full of ****, but given that it's an artist's livelihood or passion, it wouldn't get them anywhere lying about something like that.

The word of the artist trumps all.

The Batlord · 07-06-2015, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Really? I just figured that they were the type of people who respect the artist's word on their own music. Seems like a no brainer for me. I would respect a carpenter's claim that the chair he made was made out of hardwood oak much in the same way. Sure, they could be full of ****, but given that it's an artist's livelihood or passion, it wouldn't get them anywhere lying about something like that.

Unless of course they just accidentally used the wrong piece of wood and didn't notice.

This is beside the point however. I think I've shown that claiming that something is music just because the artist says it is music, is not a valid argument by itself. There are other criteria to meet, or else music has no definition.

Quote:

The word of the artist trumps all.

Yeah, that doesn't sound pretentious at all. I feel like that should be the plaque on a statue of some guy riding a horse, pointing toward the horizon.

**Frownland** · 07-06-2015, 07:16 PM

Music is whatever you want it to be. Once you start saying that music stops *here*, then you're closing yourself out of a world of new music. Whether something is or isn't music is not even an arguing point as far as I'm concerned. Whether it's clever, ****, melodic, or any other thing about it is a different story. It is most certainly a valid point by itself when an artist puts something out as music. You can go ahead and keep attempting these mental gymnastics but when it comes down to it I'm never going to disagree with an artist on whether their art is art. It's a shame that speaking out against a close minded view of music earns me the label of pretentious.

DwnWthVwls · 07-06-2015, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Once you start saying that music stops *here*, then you're closing yourself out of a world of new music.

So? I don't have to consider something music to enjoy my sense of hearing. I'm not missing out on anything I'm just classifying it as something else.

The Batlord · 07-06-2015, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frownland

Music is whatever you want it to be. Once you start saying that music stops *here*, then you're closing yourself out of a world of new music. Whether something is or isn't music is not even an arguing point as far as I'm concerned. Whether it's clever, ****, melodic, or any other thing about it is a different story. It is most certainly a valid point by itself when an artist puts something out as music. You can go ahead and keep attempting these mental gymnastics but when it comes down to it I'm never going to disagree with an artist on whether their art is art.

What that all amounts to is that music has no definition. If music has no definition then you're not arguing about music (as you've just said, but contradicted many times), you're arguing for the prestige of being able to call something music.

Quote:

It's a shame that speaking out against a close minded view of music earns me the label of pretentious.

Okay, Soulflower.

**Frownland** · 07-06-2015, 07:28 PM

Whatever music is, 4'33" is part of it. *shrug*

The Batlord · 07-06-2015, 07:31 PM

07-06-2015, 07:16 PM	#136 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	Music is whatever you want it to be. Once you start saying that music stops here, then you're closing yourself out of a world of new music. Whether something is or isn't music is not even an arguing point as far as I'm concerned. Whether it's clever, ***, melodic, or any other thing about it is a different story. It is most certainly a valid point by itself when an artist puts something out as music. You can go ahead and keep attempting these mental gymnastics but when it comes down to it I'm never going to disagree with an artist on whether their art is art. It's a shame that speaking out against a close minded view of music earns me the label of pretentious. __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth.* d e a f b o x

07-06-2015, 07:28 PM	#139 (permalink)
Frownland SOPHIE FOREVER Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: East of the Southern North American West Posts: 35,541	Whatever music is, 4'33" is part of it. shrug __________________ Studies show that when a given norm is changed in the face of the unchanging, the remaining contradictions will parallel the truth. d e a f b o x