We've got a major problem...

GuitarBizarre · 08-17-2013, 12:30 PM

Tore - Lets make a big review of what's been said, and how, knowing how the thread went, I've been reading it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I've been saying this stuff for a very long time.

I do not have all the answers, but I think it starts with this:
Make tore head moderator (his duties determined by him) and enforce all the rules he created. For threads that start going off-topic in a hostile way, the mods need to not personally participate in that and instead quickly warn and then delete and at least temporarily lock.

Also, with the exception of tore, allow members to vote mods out, and let them vote mods in, subject to at least tore's approval.

Follow that advice, and I'm likely to resume starting (good) threads, the lack of which is helping to suck life out of the forum.

1 - I was saying this before it was cool
2 - You need to do what I say to fix this.
3 - I'm so completely up my own backside that I feel I can hold hostage the idea that I might contribute to the forums, because the lack of ME is what's sucking the life out of this forum.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I'm waiting for tore to state whether he wants to be moderator #1 again. If he's willing to start another site.... Probably nobody could tell me he would make Music Banter worse, even with that weird "too idealistic" claim that I've seen applied to someone else.

Voting on mods - allow a window for nominations/demotions at the beginning of each month and if, for example, 5 people agree about someone, start a poll that runs for at least a week and requires enough votes that cliques couldn't do much damage. The thing is, The current system is the ultimate clique, friends choosing friends to work with them. And I'm not going to make (good) threads until that changes.

Deletion drama? Be very specific in posted guidelines about what will get posts deleted (for example, name-calling). But understand that if mods are actively part of that drama, deletions will be seen as unfair (mods above the law) and if moderators refrain from fighting, they'll be 'punished' less with complaints about deletions.

Lastly, I too have witnessed problems in forums that have a Politics section. I don't pay much attention to The Lounge (because I'm here for music), but if drama is starting there, then limit posting privileges in it (for example, not allowing new members to make threads there) and urge everyone to self-limit their time in that section.

1 - Repeats the claim for your numero uno moderation position.
2 - Continuing to hold his contribution to the forums hostage until other people fix everything for him.
3 - Calling for overly black and white guidelines regarding forum "drama", despite, as the thread proves, the entire moderation team agreeing that no matter how you mod, someone is going to be on your ass for it, and therefore that black and white approach doesn't WORK.
4 - A change of policy in the politics forum - that he (At least NOW) knows we don't have the power to implement.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

You speak for you. Even if that is true of the others, I'd be surprised if any moderator would approve a personally disliked individual as a new moderator, which breeds sameness. To me, most moderators seem similar to each other and not idea people, and this website needs new ideas.

Speaking of that, Pete's idea should be implemented if technically possible.

Accusing Urban of nepotism and claiming the forum members would do better in voting in new moderators (Despite having pointed out in his previous post that he doesn't believe this would work anyway)

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I've been here a few years - I don't consider myself new. Anyway, I noticed my comments were mostly disregarded and replies focused on points of disagreement. That echoes past experiences in this section and the Music section. The latter I agree is full of short, often off-topic answers and goes back to esoteric or bland topics - which I the provocative-subject generator personally could fix if I felt valued on this site.

But back to my idea from yesterday - is there a technical way to restrict new members from creating threads in The Lounge?

1 - Doesn't consider himself new, which is significant given your initial defense of him
2 - Playing the victim rather than considering that others criticisms of his points may be worthwhile.
3 - More "I was doing this before it was cool"
4 - More "This forums needs more of ME, I might be willing to provide if you all weren't so terrible, but first, more of what I like, then you get more of ME!"
5 - Technical suggestion, despite it being common knowledge on the forum for literally years that you, the person he's already praised twice, stepped down for the exact reason that you could never get technical suggestions implemented.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I agree with Trollheart and the bunny. On the points by the former, I think mocking images should be grounds for deletion of posts. On the subject of moderators, new blood is needed and probably there should be a process by which mods who have been in place for a year are subjected to a public vote (if they wish to stay on) and have to get a strong majority to keep their jobs.

1 - Attacking the mods again, and suggesting a vote system again, despite, as noted, ADMITTING earlier that he has no confidence a voting system would work. I had also provided my own rationale, as had others, as to why a voting system would not work, at this point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

What do I think members should do? Behave better, but I don't expect that unless they respect moderators and will follow their lead (but that can be a bad thing, depending on the example set). Members should post more good music stuff too, but that's a more complicated issue. I say deal with the simple stuff first. Where's your reply, tore?

Also, yes, I realize that being a moderator is a thankless job. But I think unfortunately that some people like the sense of power it gives them. I've been a moderator elsewhere.

1 - Backhanded attack on the mods and the members, again.
2 - Members should post more music stuff - Where we agree, and had already said so for most of the thread.
3 - "Tore! Tore! You blessed beast, you king of the jungle, where are you to save us all in my time of need!"
4 - Another backhanded attack on the mods, accusing them, again, of nepotism.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

No, no proof at all, but it's pretty clear that this forum has been going downhill for a while and that new ideas are needed. If this were a business and the moderators managers, some heads would roll.

1 - I knew this place was terrible before it was cool!
2 - I'd fire all those nepotistic mods if I were the boss!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I know that was tore's position, but I'm hoping it has changed lately. Clearly he's increasingly frustrated with the state of things.

By the way, on the subject of moderators again, I know of one site that had many behavioral problems, and partly as a result of gradual moderator turnover and the disappearance of an ill-tempered admin, the behavior has become quite good. People on that forum seem to really like and respect the mods. For the record, I don't want more than moderate turnover on this forum's moderators, just like a smart business wouldn't fire most of its managers.

1 - "Tore! Tore! You blessed beast, you king of the jungle, where are you! Please go against your previous thoughts on this place and save us all!"
2 - Attacks the moderators again, by using a completely irrelevant example about a completely different forum doing a completely different thing with completely different people, in order to AGAIN imply that the moderators here are bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

Are you going to implement any of the changes suggested (by anyone) in this thread, or is this forum going to keep dying? And I think it's been made clear here who some of the moderators I have a problem with are.

1 - I knew you'd not take any of the suggestions I put forward! Clearly you don't care, EH MODERATORS?
2 - Finally admits he has a problem with the moderators, and rather than just attacking them all, he now points out he just has problems with specific moderators.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I'm not into clubs, sorry. I see a thread about plug-ins. What about the changes proposed in this thread? I'm not sure a moderator has even commented on anything specific. When I asked about the technical feasibility of one of my ideas (not a change in the moderation team), crickets.

1 - Why are these changes not being implemented? Clearly you moderators don't CARE, do you?
2 - You MODERATORS clearly haven't even tried to respond to this thread, you don't CARE, DO YOU?
3 - Well *WHY* aren't these technical changes being made? HUH? (And again, these are years old issues, that YOU, tore, had a big problem with and stepped down because of. He should know this. He was told this multiple times before he made this post. He ignored the information.)