We've got a major problem...

Guybrush · 08-12-2013, 02:44 AM

I don't think Sopsych is a troll. He argues points that may be seen as provocative, but he seemingly does so from the point of view that doing so is reasonable. And so I assume that it is possible to influence his opinions by using reasonable arguments.

In other words, I don't think his opinion is one he speaks simply to irritate and cause aggravation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

So you think it is ok for Sopych to talk about MB members they should be trained like animals?

He never wrote that we should be trained like animals and so you're misinterpreting his post. I think your attitude in general shows a willingness to be offended. I believe you want to interpret his post in the worst way possible, consciously or perhaps unconsciously, because that gives you a right to act defensively, which again excuses rudeness and rash behaviour. And calling Sopsych a troll is a simple way of attacking his credibility.

In this country, both these methods would be considered a "hersketeknikk", literally translated to ruling technique, which are things you say and do manipulatively in a social situation simply in order to get the upper hand. I see the hersketeknikk, but I don't see the compelling, reasonable argument explaining why Sopsych is a troll.

edit :

Quote:

Originally Posted by Janszoon

I was asking you (and also anyone else who wants to respond of course). I'm saying the question wasn't about a specific troll, just about how we should respond to trolling in general.

Delete trolly posts and explain why they were deleted in a PM. Possibly a post in the thread announcing that posts have been deleted and why can be a good idea.

I know how hard this is

The "best" trolls learn to troll so subtly that it is hard to say, without a doubt, that they are trolling. (This could apply to Sopsych, but I personally don't think so.) In those cases, moderators often end up doing nothing, I believe, which is understandable because usually, no clear rule has been broken and moderating based on cases which walk just on the right side of a fine line will cause complaints from members of the community.

However, I think it is important that moderators recognize this sort of near-trolling and act on that too, if only by sending a PM to the ones doing it and asking them to change their behaviour.

A culture of trolling or near trolling perpetuates more of the same. By changing such a culture, you'd make the job easier for yourself in the future.

edit 2 :

Members should report more and so some increased focus on that forum function would be good. In the past, members have been asked to not report spam, which in turn may have discouraged reporting altogether, but reporting is an excellent way for moderators to get to know not only where the line is being crossed, but also what community members find offensive.

djchameleon · 08-12-2013, 03:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

I don't think Sopsych is a troll. He argues points that may be seen as provocative, but he seemingly does so from the point of view that doing so is reasonable. And so I assume that it is possible to influence his opinions by using reasonable arguments.

Of course you don't see his troll-ish behavior because he has been praising you the whole time.

If you pay attention to the people responding to him you'll understand why other people are calling him a troll. It's way past the point of just having an unpopular opinion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

He never wrote that we should be trained like animals and so you're misinterpreting his post. I think your attitude in general shows a willingness to be offended. I believe you want to interpret his post in the worst way possible, consciously or perhaps unconsciously, because that gives you a right to act defensively, which again excuses rudeness and rash behaviour. And calling Sopsych a troll is a simple way of attacking his credibility.

He didn't say we should be trained like animals but he goes on to confirm later after Neo said that , that yes we basically should.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

A culture of trolling or near trolling perpetuates more of the same. By changing such a culture, you'd make the job easier for yourself in the future.

Finally, you said something I agree with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

edit 2 :

Members should report more and so some increased focus on that forum function would be good. In the past, members have been asked to not report spam, which in turn may have discouraged reporting altogether, but reporting is an excellent way for moderators to get to know not only where the line is being crossed, but also what community members find offensive.

Yeah, I've been discouraged from reporting all together. I used to get made fun of by the mods for reporting but I think it was spam at the time. There were complaints about reports filling up something on their end idk what the reasoning is but after I heard that. I stopped reporting.

misspoptart · 08-12-2013, 04:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rostasi

As of today, I've been here a year.

I think the supreme difficulty for new members is that they may think
that they're expected to immediately begin divulging all kinds of stuff
about themselves before they're even acknowledged as simply a music-lover.
I've watched in the last year as new members (ones that aren't promoting themselves)
have become vilified and/or ignored. Some leave...some "join in the conversation" and
are "accepted," but "joining" usually means that you're expected
to go on a lot about things that have little or nothing to do with music.

I feel exactly the same way about MB, Rod. It's hard to get excited about discussing music here, when few really seem to care when you do it.

djchameleon · 08-12-2013, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by misspoptart

I feel exactly the same way about MB, Rod. It's hard to get excited about discussing music here, when few really seem to care when you do it.

this probably isn't a good time for this little off topic comment but I asked you for some gypsy music recs a couple of times and you've ignored me

~~butthead aka 216~~ · 08-12-2013, 05:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by misspoptart

I feel exactly the same way about MB, Rod. It's hard to get excited about discussing music here, when few really seem to care when you do it.

i more replying to rosti or whoever they are but my point is that this is a music community. and often in any community whether its online or real life, some level of personal info is shared and that's part of what makes something a community. and of course its everyones choice what they are willin to share

i just think in general here there are just different perspectives and thats fine. like i said i come here to bull**** about stuff and check out some music. im always in the plug the last few weeks. its like a group of friends with musical undertones. but i realize ppl come here for diff things so im not hatin on anyone

best suggestions for what the consensus wants

-dont have new posts show lounge stuff
-keep promoting using plug cause its cool and fun and easy to do
-ban herm forever lmao

Guybrush · 08-12-2013, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

Of course you don't see his troll-ish behavior because he has been praising you the whole time.

I like to think I'm not that shallow! But whatever, I feel like I've contributed enough to the discussion on whether or not Sopsych is a troll. I consider it off-topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

Yeah, I've been discouraged from reporting all together. I used to get made fun of by the mods for reporting but I think it was spam at the time. There were complaints about reports filling up something on their end idk what the reasoning is but after I heard that. I stopped reporting.

In my time as a mod, there weren't that many reports - certainly not enough to make me consider them a nuisance. In my opinion, reports do make the job a lot easier.

So, I like reports and think reporting should be encouraged.

djchameleon · 08-12-2013, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

In my time as a mod, there weren't that many reports - certainly not enough to make me consider them a nuisance. In my opinion, reports do make the job a lot easier.

So, I like reports and think reporting should be encouraged.

I hope I'm not calling out the wrong person but I believe it was Burning Down that told me about how reporting spam can be somewhat of an issue with clogging up the console or w/e it is that you mods look through.

Burning Down · 08-12-2013, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

I hope I'm not calling out the wrong person but I believe it was Burning Down that told me about how reporting spam can be somewhat of an issue with clogging up the console or w/e it is that you mods look through.

Well I'd rather that the report button be used for bad behavior rather than reporting obvious spam. You've never done this but other people have. If the spam is older than, let's say, 24 hours report away. But we usually see the spam pretty quickly.

I encourage people to report bad behavior or insults, etc. I don't think I said that to you but I do remember talking about reporting spam.

misspoptart · 08-12-2013, 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djchameleon

this probably isn't a good time for this little off topic comment but I asked you for some gypsy music recs a couple of times and you've ignored me

Yes, it's completely a terrible time. I'm reporting you for bad behavior! And didn't you see this thread?

Arya Stark · 08-12-2013, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by misspoptart

I feel exactly the same way about MB, Rod. It's hard to get excited about discussing music here, when few really seem to care when you do it.

I'm not sure I understand. Do you mean you're expected to talk all about your life and not music? And you only feel accepted if you participate in various lounge topics?

I do mean to find out, because it's important how new members feel. And as new members, what you guys say should be listened to in this thread. Especially since your welcoming is such a big topic.