We've got a major problem...

Burning Down · 08-10-2013, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

One-liners don't belong in this thread.

I was making an observation, which you obviously don't agree with based on this response.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

Okay, if Yac isn't the main man on technical decisions, who is, the corporate owners? Lessen our "ignorance." But as for new moderators, the idea isn't special negotiating powers on their part - technically, this site isn't bad, in my opinion. New moderators are for willingness to more strongly enforce rules against nastiness. A wide range of people in this thread have requested that policy change, but at least one moderator since seems to have more or less dismissed it and I suspect a few of them are the reason for the long status quo on that.

I'm not against bringing in new moderators. However, a complete overhaul of the team just for the sole reason that new moderators might be better at curbing bad behaviour and making the forum a better place is just a band aid fix. In the long run, nothing will get solved if members don't get involved in implementing changes as well. This is a community where everyone makes it what it is by participating. It's not an oppressive dictatorship.

As for the admins, well they are MIA as far as this site is concerned. We have to fend for ourselves here, unfortunately. Yac is basically our liaison with them, and he has a little more power than we do, but is not able to modify the technical aspects of the website. We just have to cope with this fact.

Neapolitan · 08-11-2013, 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

It would be better and smarter to just agree with me. If enough people did that, the site could undergo positive change. That I'd much prefer over complaining.

Now you sound like HAL2000.

Guybrush · 08-11-2013, 04:05 AM

Sopsych, thank you for your confidence. Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, there is a constraint on what moderators can do here which is a big part of why I stepped down from moderating here. For me, I found the more energy I put into MB, the more often I met that wall Urban mentioned and the more disillusioned I got. I feel like the more work you put into the site, the less it gives back compared to the work you do here. Feelings like those expressed by Pedestrian about not wanting to spend time here is something I've felt earlier, but now that I have a more casual relationship with the site, I find I am less frustrated with it.

But I partly agree with what you write, I think, although I have not read all your posts. I remember one moderator doing something here with profound effect on the community and the social dynamics here and that was Right Track. RT got fed up with some of the site's trolly members and largely took matters into his own hands and banned them. I may remember it wrong, but I don't think he asked any of us whether or not it was the right thing to do. He saw what the site needed and just did it. On one hand, it wasn't very democratic - he acted on his own and many members here wouldn't want those bans. On the other hand, I think it did improve things here drastically and, despite the way he did it, I think all us mods respected what he did.

I am not the sort of moderator RT was. I would've done what he did with a more democratic approach and chances are I never would've accomplished what he did so simply. MB being what it is, perhaps the nice, considerate approach where everyone has a say doesn't work in creating the sort of environment most of us want.

On a new site, I think the considerate, democratic approach could work better. Because then we would have more ways of promoting the environment we want, leaving it less dependent on moderation.

Trollheart · 08-11-2013, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neapolitan

Now you sound like HAL2000.

Is that HAL 9000's great-grandfather?

Sorry, but I couldn't resist man!

As for "better and smarter to agree with me", does this not sound like a certain Slipnot-obssessed member a little while back? How can it be smarter to agree with someone who seems to be the only one advocating something and who will NOT listen to REPEATED explanations as to why the things he wants to do are not possible? Surely it would, then, on the law of averages, be better and smarter NOT to agree with him?

TheBig3 · 08-11-2013, 10:12 AM

Musicbanter: The Internets leader in having posters attempt to reason with trolls.

sopsych · 08-11-2013, 11:44 AM

I wasn't trying to sound like Hal 2001. That movie probably is the worst alleged "masterpiece" I've ever seen. I am right about that too.

Anyway, tore now seems to somewhat agree with my main point. But where are potential moderators? If tore, Pedestrian, etc. don't want to do that, can they please at least name or privately seek out reform-minded candidates? After that would be the hard part about making room for them as moderators.

I fully believe that if the community becomes less harsh, people like me will step up with more music-related contributions.

One last question in this post: has moderating posts ever been tried as a way of "training" people to not fight with each other?

anticipation · 08-11-2013, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sopsych

I fully believe that if the community becomes less harsh, people like me will step up with more music-related contributions.

One last question in this post: has moderating posts ever been tried as a way of "training" people to not fight with each other?

who the fuck said we want someone like you to be more involved in any facet of MB?

Guybrush · 08-11-2013, 12:31 PM

I think the hostility towards Sopsych and how it's now manifesting in this thread is more indicative of or part of the problem than Sopsych himself is. Can't we discuss this without petty bickering and trolly posts?

anticipation · 08-11-2013, 12:48 PM

no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

**Janszoon** · 08-11-2013, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tore

I think the hostility towards Sopsych and how it's now manifesting in this thread is more indicative of or part of the problem than Sopsych himself is. Can't we discuss this without petty bickering and trolly posts?

I think people have done exactly that for most of this thread actually. It's just the past few pages that have gotten a little off track.

08-11-2013, 04:05 AM	#243 (permalink)
Guybrush Juicious Maximus III Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Scabb Island Posts: 6,525	Sopsych, thank you for your confidence. Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, there is a constraint on what moderators can do here which is a big part of why I stepped down from moderating here. For me, I found the more energy I put into MB, the more often I met that wall Urban mentioned and the more disillusioned I got. I feel like the more work you put into the site, the less it gives back compared to the work you do here. Feelings like those expressed by Pedestrian about not wanting to spend time here is something I've felt earlier, but now that I have a more casual relationship with the site, I find I am less frustrated with it. But I partly agree with what you write, I think, although I have not read all your posts. I remember one moderator doing something here with profound effect on the community and the social dynamics here and that was Right Track. RT got fed up with some of the site's trolly members and largely took matters into his own hands and banned them. I may remember it wrong, but I don't think he asked any of us whether or not it was the right thing to do. He saw what the site needed and just did it. On one hand, it wasn't very democratic - he acted on his own and many members here wouldn't want those bans. On the other hand, I think it did improve things here drastically and, despite the way he did it, I think all us mods respected what he did. I am not the sort of moderator RT was. I would've done what he did with a more democratic approach and chances are I never would've accomplished what he did so simply. MB being what it is, perhaps the nice, considerate approach where everyone has a say doesn't work in creating the sort of environment most of us want. On a new site, I think the considerate, democratic approach could work better. Because then we would have more ways of promoting the environment we want, leaving it less dependent on moderation. __________________ Something Completely Different Last edited by Guybrush; 08-11-2013 at 12:06 PM.

08-11-2013, 10:12 AM	#245 (permalink)
TheBig3 killedmyraindog Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 11,172	Musicbanter: The Internets leader in having posters attempt to reason with trolls. __________________ I've moved to a new address

08-11-2013, 11:44 AM	#246 (permalink)
sopsych Music Addict Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: indoors Posts: 722	I wasn't trying to sound like Hal 2001. That movie probably is the worst alleged "masterpiece" I've ever seen. I am right about that too. Anyway, tore now seems to somewhat agree with my main point. But where are potential moderators? If tore, Pedestrian, etc. don't want to do that, can they please at least name or privately seek out reform-minded candidates? After that would be the hard part about making room for them as moderators. I fully believe that if the community becomes less harsh, people like me will step up with more music-related contributions. One last question in this post: has moderating posts ever been tried as a way of "training" people to not fight with each other? __________________ If you have ideas or feedback for the site, visit The Musicbanter Improvement Thread.

08-11-2013, 12:31 PM	#248 (permalink)
Guybrush Juicious Maximus III Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Scabb Island Posts: 6,525	I think the hostility towards Sopsych and how it's now manifesting in this thread is more indicative of or part of the problem than Sopsych himself is. Can't we discuss this without petty bickering and trolly posts? __________________ Something Completely Different Last edited by Guybrush; 08-11-2013 at 12:49 PM.

08-11-2013, 12:48 PM	#249 (permalink)
anticipation Music Addict Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 3,565	no!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!