People here hardly know me or my motives, but like someone else said, there's a forum tendency to be negative toward outsiders and expect the worst.

I thought about the Journal section again and now wonder whether it gets people to join via writings that show up in search engines. I then keyword searched the New Members section about that, without finding relevant recent results. I wish moderators would seriously investigate why the rate of new member contributions has been dropping - making things friendlier is worthwhile in itself and could only help, but what if that plus more music threads don't help enough?

@Sopsych

i don't think is that easy..
just making more threads won't help it's about the attitude you bring to this place and how you behave around here

In the last month you have had about 10 posts in the music forums and over 50 in this thread complaining. you didn't participate in the mixtapes/album reviews/journals or really anything else in that time. Not to mention your biggest problem seems to be how we treat new users here. Well everyone else in this thread who is kindly trying to help you out is seen welcoming newbies in all the intro threads...where are you???

A Fraction of the Noobs Not Helped By You
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...317-hello.html
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...e-bigmala.html
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...uron-here.html
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...2-im-back.html
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...-new-town.html
http://www.musicbanter.com/introduct...124-hello.html

My point you ask? You have no room to make suggestions or complain if you are not even doing your part.

Don't forget though Rez - The forum will be amazing once he starts contributing - he just refuses to do so until the forum is changed according to "his vision".

Welcoming new members over there hardly seems to help, and it should be done by friendly people who relate to them.

I said I'm not interested in journals. I'm also not interested in mixtapes. What I want is non-technical, non-esoteric, meaningful music discussion. If there were lots of that, my music post count would be higher. It probably also would make more new members stick around.

I have been thinking about topics to post, but I'm not ready to do that. I have to be happier with things first (and have more free time). Meanwhile, to anyone who is already trying to start more conversation, I can (arrogantly) give a few tips for how to get discussion going. The forum needs a bunch of members who are good at that:
An interesting title, probably in question form or as a strongly worded (but not absurd) claim
A subject that hasn't often been asked before
A subject to which a wide variety of readers could respond (not Dio vs. Tony Martin, though that was well-written)
A subject that makes people think and keep thinking (but can be tentatively answered, not like asking what's the best song ever)

One of the lamer thread ideas I have (and mostly abides by that list) is hereby presented, for anyone who wants to steal or improve it:
What's the best solo album by someone usually thought of as a band member?

I started one here: http://www.musicbanter.com/classical...ant-today.html

Vote and comment if you'd like to.

Without re-opening old arguments, I´d like to make a couple of comments after reading through this intensely-debated thread:-

First, I´d like to voice my support for the mods, who continue to do a difficult, largely thankless job. On this occasion I think Freebase, Urban, Janzsoon and Burning Down have done a great job in coping with, refuting and considering some of sopsych´s allegations. All proponents of free speech, they have to make judgement calls about the difficult-to-define line where some kind of control is necessary for the good of the community. When they do so, I don´t think it´s fair that they should be subjected to a kind of grilling more appropriate for a war criminal at the International Court of Human Rights. This place is, after all, just a music forum.

Next, I´d like to thank GuitarBizarre who had the patience and courage to spell out, with uncanny accuracy, my own dis-satisfactions with Hermione and sopsych as forum members. Credit also goes to Trollheart for rightly defending his patch of turf: the journals.

I have great respect for tore and count him as one of my friends on MB, although some of his ethical points in this thread were a bit over my head. BTW, anyone who thinks tore defended sopsych because sopsych thinks tore is God is doing tore a great injustice, imo. On a happier note, or perhaps a reminder of happier times, I´d like to mention again just one of tore´s many popular contributions to MB :- http://www.musicbanter.com/announcem...-calendar.html

I always thought this was a fun way to focus attention on our various music forums, and it drew in newcomers and old-timers alike; isn´t there any one who´d care to pick it up again?

Finally, I don´t think, as a community we need to agonize overmuch if not many new members stick around. In fact MB does many good things and it does them well - if those things don´t appeal to everyone who logs in, it may be due to external/personal factors outside the control of MB members.

People mentioning me needlessly in order to insult me - when is the atmosphere going to be against that?

Burning Down, I appreciate that you're following my formula. However, I probably won't post in that thread, because that genre has never been relevant to me or something I care to think about, and the poll question is a bit too broad (I personally would have included a "Don't know" option). Edit: I'd already thought of a topic similar to that, and maybe someday I'll post it and beat yours in replies :)

Your criticisms of the community and complete lack of constructive effort draw negative energy from people who are comfortable in their niches and willing to contribute.

The Problem-Cause
 

Too many people in the world complain!

Thanks for your appreciation, but I'm not sure why you didn't make that post in my thread, seeing as you're all for fostering music discussion. The genre shouldn't matter, it's beside the point. Also, this is not a competition. A thread with more replies than a similar one does not make it better (or worse, for that matter). Your thread does not need to be better than mine or have more replies, but if that ends up happening, it doesn't matter - it's not a contest.

I don't get it. You ask and encourage people to make threads like that - asking a question, uncommon subject, etc etc etc, and you come back with "I probably won't post in it". You want the community to make better threads but yet you won't participate in those discussions. Please answer me this: What is the point? Why should people heed your advice when you don't follow it yourself? "Someday you'll post a thread"? I'm not holding my breath.

Maybe he senses that he's gone too far and will never be taken seriously again because he's established a reputation that will be nearly impossible to shake without more effort and patience on his part than he is capable of exercising.

Yet he is still putting an enormous amount of time and energy into this particular thread. Again, what is the point of that?

Getting a rise out of people because he's bitter. It's working. What we should do is ignore him until he makes a positive effort.

Maybe if he comes up with a five year plan to implement his Orwellian vision of this site he would be taken more seriously.

You make too much sense. Get out of this thread.

I made like 3 posts saying just that. People have the right to complain as much as they want...if they contribute themselves.

Right, that is what I'm talking about (the posts we both refer to) when I say that people think they're responding appropriately in a situation when they're actually just prolonging drama. When you sense you're not getting through to someone, drop the subject. I just can't grasp this need for people to get the last word into an argument.

I was just annoyed because I think this thread is great, and allowing him to babble on just continuously derails it and prevents any real progress we were making.

Rez, I don't agree with everything this guy writes and I wish he was more diplomatic and not so uncompromising with his posts, but as for what derails the thread, take a look at the last couple of pages now. You'll see posts like this :

Now, I love you guys and I understand your irritation, but all these posts contribute to derailing the thread. And it's you guys who make them. If, instead of voicing your opinion every time you get annoyed, you guys could just avoid expressing that annoyance or mentally ignore the annoying post - or actually put the guy on ignore, that would help keep the thread on topic.

If we all gotta make an effort to keep the forums friendly and less hostile, can't we start now?

i havent seen any of this hostility since herm was banned lol i know most ppl prob feel the same way. guess i just dont see the hostility around here some ppl are talkin about. soppych is earnin whatever responses he is gettin. i dont think anyone should be concerned about what he/she personally wants cause its ridic anyways

Maybe because we did voice our opinion, several times...yet he continued to ignore everything we said and continue to waste space with these complaints. I understand you are a diplomatic person but come on...this guy is clearly beyond getting any respect from me or anyone else.

Tore, All you're proving here is that people are frustrated with sopsych. Their rationale for being frustrated is sound and their response frankly proportionate. Come down from the clouds.

This whole mess could have been solved long ago, when sopsych responded to the thread split with direct threats to the mods. The fact he wasn't immediately banned at that point mystifies me, because there was and is absolutely no call for such petulant, childish threats and he had already clearly stated his lack of intention to actually contribute by that time.

Maybe I'm wrong about how good our mods are. Maybe that was simply an example of a fragmented, ****ed up mod team that needs a serious reality check on when and where to draw lines. Whatever it is, an approach so incredibly passive shouldn't have been taken at that point. He should have been immediately banned. Potentially permanently.

I agree with this except for the permanently part. Tell him to take it to the other thread, stop posting period, or be banned. 3 days sends the message.

Then again, I've said he was a troll for a week now and no one listened to me. I'm like Churchill warning against the rise of Hitler. You all think I'm some crazy looney in the corner until sopsych invades Poland.

Then we'll see.

And so it continues.

"We've got a major problem..."

It won't get better with this attitude. There'll always be another Sopsych.

And how, tore, do you suppose it will get better if every time someone incites a riot, rather than taking action, the mods let it consume 30 or 40 pages of an otherwise positive thread,split, close it, let it continue in the original thread,ignore threats,ignore the rest of the members, allow it to grow out of all control and allow members to take sides and turn it into a civil war,and then eventually just close what could have been a positive thread, without taking action against any one or group of members,because the mods are either too **** scared to incite the forums ire, or theyre so divided within themselves that the inaction is the direct result of their infighting?



We have over 40 pages of ****storm now. Why has nothing been moderated whatsoever, bar a failed thread split? Answer - pussyfooting around and playing the blame game against the community like you are now encouraging.

Closing this thread
Any ideas you have can be posted here..

http://www.musicbanter.com/announcem...ml#post1358976