Rainard Jalen

Do you really consider 10,000 Days an epically great album? Why is it that fans find it so hard to come to terms with songs like Intension and Right In Two being filler tracks? Rosetta Stoned is, in reality, just a very long filler track made by combining a bunch of mindless jams. It couldn't have taken but a couple of sessions to construct. Maynard's long tribute to his mother seems totally out of place and plays more like an excruciatingly long mishmashed collage of ideas than a well thought-out coherent masterpiece. What it boils down to is that in all those years between Lateralus and 10,000 Days, Tool came up with a mere THREE particularly memorable tracks, and they are Track 1, Track 2 and Track 5 (named previously).

The problem with this band is that they've created a fanbase that hold certain deeply entrenched, set expectations of them. Thus, in order to abide by the fans' and their label's expectations, they're given very little room to manoeuvre, explore their own musical interests, and innovate. Keenan, as a prime example, has been reported as being quite interested in Indie music over the past however many years. In interviews he has also been reported to have stated feeling slightly uneasy about having bands even darker than Tool (e.g. Mastodon) starting for them and said he would have personally preferred a band like the Yeah Yeah Yeahs.

If a fan cannot spot that 10,000 Days explores very little (if any) new ground and is more of an attempt to please and satiate already established Tool lovers more than anything else, then I'm amused. Ask yourselves this: if 10,000 Days had come out back in 2001 instead of Lateralus, what would the reactions have been then?

This band have, I anticipate, absolutely nothing left within the current set framework they appear to work within. They can force something, sure - and I dare say that much of 10,000 Days feels forced - but if they won't be braver than that and actually do something creative the next time out, then there really might as well not be a next time.

jackhammer

Who? the original poster?

__________________

Ace

To say Right In Two is filler, shows that you've got absolutely no clue.
It's perhaps the most meaningful song on the cd, save Vicarious.
The lyrics speak for themselves.

"Angels on the sideline,
Baffled and confused
Father blessed them all with reason
And this is what they choose
Monkey killing monkey killing monkey
Over pieces of the ground

Silly monkeys give them thumbs,
They forge a blade, and where there's one
They're bound to divide it,
Right in two"


"Monkey killing monkey killing monkey
Over pieces of the ground
Silly monkeys give them thumbs
They make a club and beat their brother down
How they survive so misguided is a mystery"

Seriously, you call this filler?
To say this song is deep, would be an understatement.

__________________

Quote:

Originally Posted by RezZ I think I know much better than you ever will how Mettalica is. I used to play for 2 years in a Mettalica cover band.

Rainard Jalen

lmao. Deep? Those lyrics are among the most simplistic drivel I heard on any album in 2006! Go read a book or something.

Woah! Chill! I was making a simple point that hopefully would lead to some discussion: namely, that the album was borne out of a lack of ideas; that it was, perhaps, what Tool HAD to do rather than what they might have LIKED to do.

Toolheads in general, I'm not tryna wind y'all up. Just think this is a discussion-worthy topic, is all. Most of the more even-minded Tool fans have already admitted that 10,000 Days was not quite (and pretty far off) the epic masterpiece that was hoped for a full five years on from Lateralus. That's not to say it was a piece of garbage, no, it was not that at all. But to me, it rung of a tired band all but totally dried up, who ought to be trying something else besides attempting to reduplicate their earlier successes.

Rainard Jalen

What do you mean, "how do I have the right to have an opinion on something like that"? It's called making inferences. It's fairly common practise. The album suggests, explicitly points even, towards a fundamental lack of ideas. This is the impression people generally get from it, that is, all but the most unrelenting of Tool fans who would refuse to accept that as even being among the range of logical possibilities. On the contrary, why should I NOT have an opinion on something like that?

That there aren't an awful lot of ideas contained within this album is nothing that strays too far beyond the realms of the obvious. As for the question of how long it would take to write, then fair enough, there's no way anybody could possibly know that. Actually, the guess I was making was an attempt to construe Maynard, Carey and the boys in a better light. I mean, it could well have taken them years to write all those tracks, but if it did then that's rather downright shameful. I'd rather hope, or like to think, that if they put their collective brains together and spent a good long time on a project they'd be able to accomplish something at least a good (if not a great) deal superior.

To Ace, on the topic of "Right In Two", my views have been summed up by other than myself here. The lyrics are at best mundane, and that they are hackneyed is beyond question. Go read a few actual BOOKS (know what they are?) on philosophy, religion, anthropology etc.. I promise you you'll never find Maynard James Keenan's lyrics profound again.

Rainard Jalen

No. Arrogant jackassery is half the fun of it.

Ace

I take it you don't know anything about religion, or even history, if you don't know what that song is about.
Try researching the fall of man.
Maynard often involves religion in his writing, and it is apparent on the whole album.
This song describes man's continual overall recession throughout history, and you don't even have to be a Tool fan to appreciate the meaning of Right In Two. If you don't like the album, good for you, but you'll get nowhere trying to say tracks are filler. The only one I can say that about, is Lipan Conjuring. I've also heard Wings For Marie, 10,000 Days, and Viginti Tres are all one track. Mix the three together and it blends perfectly. Whether or not that is official, I don't know. It does create a very nice track once mixed properly, and if they actually intended to do that, it would take their work to an entirely different level.
Point is, just about all of their work has to be digested.
So if its too strong for your stomache, move on to something else.

__________________

Quote:

Originally Posted by RezZ I think I know much better than you ever will how Mettalica is. I used to play for 2 years in a Mettalica cover band.

sleepy jack

I don't care how deep the song is or how historical the topic is, bad lyrics are bad lyrics and filler is filler.

__________________

Ace

I knew you'd post something in response to that, Ethan. My question is, since you've obviously had some kind of inner dislike for me over the past few days, (since I commented right-track about you and others bashing forum members), when are you going to take your head out of your arse? However, if you'd like to argue out the topic for the sake of talking music, be my guest. I do find it ironic that I said to myself, "Ethan will probably make a comment on my last post", and you actually doing it 10 minutes later....

__________________

Quote:

Originally Posted by RezZ I think I know much better than you ever will how Mettalica is. I used to play for 2 years in a Mettalica cover band.

sleepy jack

I believe I made a perfectly valid point on the lyrics and music, one which you didn't even bother to reply to. But thank you for being so mature as to not get personal with this.

That's kind of what I'm doing, hence why I replied talking about the song.

And finally, how is that irony?

Back to the subject on hand...The lyrics are banal, comparing man to monkey is extremely cliche. Maynard isn't a good lyricist, Tool fanboys go on and on about how he's amazing but he's really not, he's completely average, that song is no exception. I can think of several songs about war that are way better written then that. Your Revolution is a Joke is a fairly recent one by a mediocre band (Funeral for a Friend) and even THEY do better.

__________________