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Originally Posted by VeggieLover
You are oppressing feminists in the same way that you argue they oppress the rest of women and men. Not all feminists (indeed, not even the majority!) strive to catagorize women into "GI janes." Infact, that incredible generalization is exactly what the ideals of feminism are agianst. People are radically different from each other, whether they are male or female, and whenever we try and put large groups of people into little boxes based on the actions of a few radicals, well thats what we should all try and fight.
Also, you say women should dress/act sexy if they want to. The question is... would they want to if the media and our society handled sexuality and attractive-ness differently? Would you be so attracted to the thin large-breasted women if you hadn't been raised to do so?
Personally it offends me that the photo of Beth Ditto is such a big deal. Larger women (and men) shouldn't have any more reason to be ashamed of their bodies than anyone else. We're all human!
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VeggieLover,
You expressed yourself beautifully in your post (and I'm not just saying that because we both love vegetables). When the media present a certain view of women (or of men) as ideal, then this not only reflects culture but also
shapes culture, and often seems to result in people feeling bad about their bodies, which helps no one (except those who produce a myriad of beauty products and get rich off of human insecurities).
I do feel it is important that public policy encourages an understanding of health so that all people, whether heavyset or thin, can know steps to take (no pun intended) to improve their health, but like you I don't want anyone to be ridiculed for her or his body.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo
I admit that hairy legs on a girl really grosses me out. But as long as I don't tell women to shave their legs, they shouldn't make me feel bad because I have different standards of beauty.
A running gag here is that I have a strange fetish for women with shaved heads. And I do hate the attitute people give me for it as well as how men treat those that go for the bald look.
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Hehe, boo boo, so you must like Sinaed! (
YouTube - nothing compares). I thought I recalled reading somewhere else about your affinity for bald women. Bald is beautiful!
People's opinions about bodies are affected not only by genetics but culture, obviously, and that is as it is and I am okay with it. For example, evolutionary biologists might say one reason you prefer women without leg hair is this makes them look more youthful, and there is an evolutionary advantage (higher potential for more offspring) if a male procreates with a younger female. When someone's appearance becomes the main characteristic that others think of when dealing with that person, though, that concerns me, especially if they treat a person disrespectfully because of her or his appearance.
A lot of your concern seems to revolve around your feeling that you are being told to find all women attractive. I do feel it is understandable that you, like all of us, have your own preferences for beauty and I certainly support you in finding people you feel are attractive. After growing up in a society where women shave, I don't know if even *I* would classify my leg hair as "attractive"...I see it as more just being there and a pleasant reminder that I am a mammal. In my case, I see intellect and non-conformity as attractive (I picked my mate in large part for his beautiful brain), so if I see a man with longer hair I look at him longer and with more interest. I actually think that people appreciating each other for physical as well as personality characteristics is a very healthy and important part of society...attraction and flirting are a nice social glue that bonds people together.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boo boo
I feel that a lot of feminists only want to challenge these social norms because they want to create norms of their own. And a lot of them seem to go about it in a morally imperialistic way.
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I can understand you not liking moral imperialism. One gripe I have as a feminist is the U.S. version of Sharia laws for women: men can be in public topless, but women get arrested if they have their shirts off. This is an example of sexual oppression (the laws were put in place mainly by men, and I suspect many women are raised to see their breast nudity as "lewd"). I would like to create a different norm: one that results in people wanting laws for women and men to be the same.