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Originally Posted by Crowquill
The idea that Iraq should have been dealt with may be somewhat valid.
The point that it should have been dealt with by us, however, is
absurd.
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We're the biggest superpower in the world and more than anyone we could get it done. Who in the f*ck else would you suggest? Poland?
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Anthony Arnove, ed. Iraq Under Seige, 2nd Edition (South End Press, 2002)
Carl Kaysen et al, War with Iraq (American Academy of Arts and
Sciences, Committee on International Security Studies, 2002)
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Links would be more appropiate.
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That threat was dealt with. I'm not defending Saddam, he was a brutal
tyrant. He wasn't our business however. It isn't our job to police the
world. None of this is why we went in there in the first place. We do
not care about Iraqi civilians. We've killed 150,000 of them, they're
not our concern in Iraq. Companies like Haliburton, Lockheed Martin,
Boeing Company, General Dynamics Corporation, Raytheon Company, and
Science Applications International Company, companies which government
officials and their buddies have major stock in, benefit HUGELY from
war. They make money like you wouldn't believe. War means big money
for them.
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Thats a no brainer. I agree with you completely.
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Are you some kind of soothsayer? Us leaving Iraq, and thus
eliminating American casualties from the equation by removing them
from the midst of the ruthless religion/civil war taking place in Iraq
is worse than what is happening there today? It is already in a bloody
civil war, people are dying by the hundreds everyday. Their is warfare
in the streets of the city, it doesn't get worse than that.
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Right now, we're trying to keep whats going on in Iraq under somewhat of a giant glass, leaving would simply be removing that glass and allowing the civil war to escalate to god knows where.
One thing we should do the we aren't doing the way we should is securing Iraqs borders, to prevent terrorists from coming in, and a lot of them are coming in, this is a problem we should have dealt with much earlier. Another horrible decision on Bushs part.
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Well, if it weren't for human reproduction capabilities, Stalin never
would have been born, so I guess that means that sex is a bad thing by
your logic. Luckily, as I have already said, your logic is absolutely
terrible. Healthy countries need revolution. It's what brings about
change.
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Revolution is good in the right hands, muslim extremists is not the right hands.
After 9/11, many Iraqis ran to the streets ran to the streets to celebrate, the idea of them appointing their officials scares me sh*tless.
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The good old days? Many of those on that list revolted AFTER the
Bolshevik revolution in Russia, which was NOT a bad thing. The people
were living in poverty under the Czar, they were still on the
serf-system, a system which the rest of the world outgrew 600 years
earlier before the renaissance and after the Crusades. They were
better under the Czar? Thats a ridiculous statement. They were fine
under Lenin, and unfortunately, against all the revolutionaries
wishes, Stalin gained power. Stalin, as a singular ruler, was
undoubtedly bad for Russia, but in the late-60's, even Russia
realized how much of a demon Stalin was. Now the country is a
super-power, under the Czar they were a faltering medevil state. I
don't support Stalin, or like him, but the Communist leaders were
better for Russia than the Czars were.
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In general communism is better for them, but Stalin was worse than any Czar. Whatever, that was just an example. Lets drop this.
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It is almost tiring to have to mention constantly the fact that you
cannot follow a train of thought. The Crusades were never used as
reason to establish that Iraq wasn't a threat. I don't know how you
are reading these posts, but that wasn't even insinuated. In
conjunction with that statement I said religion should NEVER be in
position of power. Iraq was not under Sharia rule. Iran is, but we
didn't invade them. Your so illogical its ridiculous.
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Go way back, I said we should have dealt with Iran first.
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How do you know they'll hate us more if we leave? They hate us now,
who cares if they 'hate us more'?
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Ever heard the saying
putting more fuel into the fire?
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The point is, we cannot be
absolutely sure of the alternative to staying there, but we are there
now, and it will not be worse. American casualties will be eliminated,
thats a good thing. We will stop throwing money into this useless war,
that is a good thing. Well, I take that back. That would be a good
thing for the citizens of American, but for the leaders who are making
money like crazy, it would be a bad thing, which is why we stay.
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Fine. You win, lets pull out of Iraq. And if another 9/11 happens a few years down the road, don't try and ask me to forgive you for being wrong.
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Going into Iraq to control their natural resources was a terrible
idea. Just because they dress it up by saying 'Saddam was horrible!"
doesn't make it a just-war. We were the agressors upon a country which
posed no threat to us. Nazi's were hung for that at Nuremburg.
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Funny how everyone denies that Saddam intended to have a powerful offensive millitary. Even though its a fact.
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No, I won't stop with historical comparisons. History is more relevant
in examine the present than anything else. The context, the language,
the execution, it is all exactly the same as it was during the
imperialist times. You're not supposed to be well-educated on
imperialist times for just this reason, you will be too blind to draw
historical comparisons and view the outcomes of those desicions.
Ignorance is bliss however, you're a shining example.
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You don't draw your examples well however. I bet if we invaded North Korea you would say its just like Nicaragua too.
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The only thing that has changed since 9/11 is the fear Americans have
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Gee. How irrational of us.
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which the government exploits, enormously successfully I might add.
They've got you justifying their ridiculous wars through fear.
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The goverment has no control over my opinions. Why do they care if I support them or not? I'm a libertarian who thinks drugs and prostitution should be legal. Not the kinda guy a Republican would want working for him.
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Nicaragua is an example of a democracy we overthrew.
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But Iraq was not a democracy, and it wasnt a poor country that posed no threat. This is why they are different.
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Yet we are supposed to believe its a good thing for the US to bring
democracy to the Middle East, its some moral obligation we have. Kinda
like White-Man's Burden in the 19th century 
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Again, no matter how evil our intentions were, it should have been done, nothing is going to change that.
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If we are so interested in spreading democracy, then why do we
overthrow them when they are established without our help? You answer
that with your logic. The reason we overthrow them is because they set
the example that you can have a democracy without the US pulling the
strings.
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Yeah, we pull the strings of every democracy in the world, keep telling yourself that.
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Thats a bad example as far as the US is concerned, the more
countries whose strings we can pull the better. We'd rather have a
pro-US ruthless dictator, than an anti-US democratically elected
president. That is a fact.
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Ok, lets go to war with France.
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How does the UN not deal with things? What have they NOT dealt with?
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And I'm the one who dosen't know his history.
Umm. DOES DARFUR RING A BELL? How about Srebrenica? The UN did NOTHING.
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If a country wants to establish a Marxist economy, whats wrong with
that? Its no better or worse than an Adam Smith economy. When the UN
doesn't feel the need to 'deal with' something, that doesn't mean that
the US has to become vigilantes and deal with it ourselfs. Our leaders
should be tried for what they've done.
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So, the UN are not at fault for anything? The reason we act the role of world police as you put it is because the UN dosen't do its job. I wish they would. I don't like how we deal with foreign affairs any more than you do.
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It won't be a facade? It already is, remember Paul Bremer?
What has Israel got to do with this at all?
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Is Israel not another one of those fecades you talk so much about?
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Geez your logic sucks. Your ignorant to history, and you look like a
fool when you say 'fiction fiction' and then are proved 100% wrong.
How is that for talking points?
Orlando Bosch? Emmanuel Constant? Are these fictional characters who I made up?
If you don't feel like a fool then there is some kind of disconnect
between synapses in your brain.
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Ok. You did prove me wrong about protecting terrorists from the FBI. The people who are harboring them obviously should be held accountable.