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Originally Posted by Lord Larehip
But I asked him point-blank if he knew these guys and i can't get a straight answer. H enever said anything about documentaries or anything else. If that's where he learned what he clams to know about these guys then he would have said so. He's making an assumption and stating it as though it is fact. And he knows he overstepped his boundaries and got called on it
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Where did you learn that the Ramones were in any way influenced by Dada? Did
you know them personally? The only argument I could make that MIGHT indicate that they were influenced by Dada is that Joey's mom was a gallery owner. You are aware that one of the Ramones most famous songs is "Now I Wanna Sniff Some Glue", aren't you? You know the lyrics, right? You do realize you are doing the same thing by assuming punk is dead and stating that as a fact, don't you? He may not have answered your question and he may not have sourced any documentaries but that doesn't make his point any less accurate.
Edit: I don't know if he edited his post before or after your response but he actually did include a link to the Ramones' wikipedia entry in regards to their influences.
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and speaking of documentaries, you might want to watch one called "American Hardcore" where they interview the hardcore bands of the 80s all the biggies--Black Flag, Bad Brains, Minor Threat, Die Kreuzen, MDC, etc. and they all said hardcore was dead by the end of '85. What will strike you is that none of them dispute that it ended. One guys said, "We used to be a hardcore punk band but now we're just a hard rock and roll band."
Another said, "There will be another musical revolution and it will be intense and energetic and the kids will go nuts over it but it won't be hardcore."
Yet another said that every 15 years or so there will be a new thing coming along.
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1st, did you not see the post with video containing the Locust song?
2nd, it may be dead in the sense that none of the original bands are continuing to play anymore but there have been plenty of hardcore bands after Minor Threat and friends broke up. It might be considered a part of a different subgenre but it's still in essence hardcore, the same way hardcore is in essence still punk. It didn't die, it got overrun by skinheads and bull**** scene politics only a teenager could relate to. Old bands got older and did something different. New bands saw a template and took it in different directions, for better and worse.
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So I say, take what punk taught you and build something new. No sense building what's already built.
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You're looking at this through a repulsively consumerist lens, as if genres of music don't evolve but rather appear just as quickly as they get replaced- like a house being torn down and then replaced by a condominium complex. As if anything that isn't completely ground breaking and of-the-minute isn't worthy of attention. You're refusing to see music as a continuum, to acknowledge that there indeed is a common beam of support between the The Wipers and Nirvana, Stiff Little Fingers and Dillinger Four. Part of artistic growth is recycling- looking back while pushing forward.
That's not building what's already built. That's building on top of what's already built. It's turning a one floor single family home into a sky scraper. Do you get my metaphor?
Do you know what happens to a tall structure when you take out it's base?
Also, I like how you completely ignored the last paragraph of my post you quoted, pretty much exemplifies to a tee what I meant. Forget about punk for a minute, if you take anything away from this thread, let it be this:
You are one of those people whose head is so far up their own ass, who is so self-deluded and stubborn, that you've reached a point where you cannot understand anything that isn't your own ****.
Either get with the program or just **** off already.