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Originally Posted by Surell
I just have to point out that your tirade against Hip hop is fundamentally incorrect, as it is born not only out of a similar culture as Punk but ethos as well (i.e. DIY, can't play instruments, pointing out flawed systems, and so on).
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Even if I accept this as true, there ain't room enough in this town for both of
'em so I pick punk.
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And cite dadaism all you want, I don't think that much original punk was that god damned intelligible.
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That's true of hip-hop. Punk was that way from the beginning. Just look at the MC5--by the mid-60s were free jazz fanatics (Rob Tyner took his name from McCoy Tyner) who were avowed anarchists which they preached from the stage and involved in various anarchist and extreme left causes. And those movements all embraced dada if you ever bothered to check--were founded by dadaists. Punk wasn't born from dada, it was continuation of it. There would have been no punk without dada. That not every punk band knew s-hit about dada doesn't prove anything. I know people who hate the Beatles but love all these bands that never would have existed without them.
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It's kinda supposed to dodge pretensions like that.
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There was nothing pretentious about dada. They went head on against the Nazis and some ended up in the camps. They had a hell of a lot more guts than a lot of people today who fancy themselves rebellious when their "tude" consists of nothing but zoning out on ecstasy in a f-ucking rave somewhere, who only get mad when the cops interrupt their party.
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Nothing against Dadaism, but you don't have to participate in it to be opposed to war or politics.
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Again, that doesn't mean anything because the antiwar consciousness was raised by organizations that were either founded by or spun off of organizations founded by dadaists and other surrealists. The guy carrying a placard protesting a war may not be aware that he's doing this because dadaists came up with it but that's just his ignorance. It's not the reality.
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Also, Detroit is cool, it did kinda give us the Stooges.
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And it also gave us the MC5 so there you go.