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Old 06-09-2011, 05:25 PM   #59 (permalink)
Gregor XIII
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1) We do have their writings, but not the original, handwritten copies. Only copies of copies of copies of transcripts of copies. While it seems overwhelmingly likely that they existed, we cannot be completely sure, that their writings were not written by a small group of conspirators. Perhaps even much later.

2) You continue to take that out of a context... You, my friend, need to work on your debating skills. I promise I'll work on my english skills then. What is there is a comparison between Yeshua and an Urban Legend. Both of them developed over a short period of time - as opposed to Hercules, who therefore has nothing to do with this, really - but people would have been much more concerned about the details about Yeshua, since he meant much more to them.

3) Seruously? You want me to do your work? It's not my job to develop counter-thesises, when I'm perfectly fine believing in the dominant one. That would be your job.

You, my friend, has stopped seeming like a sceptic to me. You seem more like a denier (which does not mean that you are like other kinds of deniers). But ok. As I see it, there are three thesises:

1) Yeshua. What are the problems with this thesis? Yes there is a lack of concrete evidence (if you discount the gospels, the dead sea scrolls and Josephus, which hardly is what a historian would do...), but that isn't really surprising, so it can't be used as evidence against it.

2) Developed out of folklore. Elements of Jesus definitely did so. But some of the details, like dying under Pilatus, like coming from Nazareth. There is such an agreement about this, and it has happened in 40 years, that it seems unlikely. I would say, that there must be some agency behind it.

3) Conspiracy. Some people made it up to further their own goals. But then much of the gospels seem counterproductive. Why would he be from Nazareth? Why would he have followed John the Baptist if he had been the Messiah all along? Why did he talk against giving money to the church (something the church completely negated afterwards, obviously).

I can't see other hypothesis. The story of the creation of the gospels is probably a mixture of the three, but without a healthy dose of 1) it becomes really hard to explain.
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